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December 2022 Medium-Long Range Disco


WxUSAF
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1 hour ago, CAPE said:

Not enough spacing/too much confluence kills the chance of a coastal this run. Wave just dampens. 

 

1 hour ago, Ji said:

there are so many ways to fail...even when things look good!

 

1 hour ago, WxUSAF said:

Blocking giveth and blocking taketh away

All this... There is a path here, but its narrow because the amount of confluence needed to force a system under us starting out that far north is so extreme its also likely to shred the system if thing's don't go exactly right.  We saw this a few times back in 2021 where a system originally supposed to cut way north ended up shredded to nothing by the time it got to us.  Does not mean it can't work out...but I still think our best bet would be for the system to kinda split and get a healthy front runner wave into the CAD rather then having the energy come out more consolidated and trying to slide under the block.  Yea that has bigger upside...but more often then not either the primary mucks up the mid levels OR if there is enough confluence the system gets shredded and washes out.  

 

But I am not pessimistic overall... this first wave COULD work...but I think there are likely to be better opportunities later.  If we do get any significant snow from this first threat I consider it a bonus.  

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39 minutes ago, CAPE said:

It's December. The favorable pattern is just getting established. You'll take 2-4 with sleet and rain and be happy.

The setup leading into it is nowhere near identical (in the sense that we're dealing with a major Midwest storm as depicted on the models) but the lack of major costal development and angle of precipitation as shown on the GFS heavily reminds me of 12/16/10, another event where an episode of blocking was becoming established. To my memory that was a clean 1-3" during the daytime, and a nice early sendoff into the winter break. I have yet to look at the h500 comparisons though, but the PNA was not all that favorable for that month either.

1396780294_ezgif.com-gif-maker(3).gif.6876e9349d8b67e33dd085284a8a1819.gif

 

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Rather than focusing on each model run's exact depiction of the storm, at this point, it's best to look at the trends of each model over the past 48 hours, and just about every run for each of the major models has trended south.  Not sure we are done trending south either due to the strength of the block and the spacing between the two storms.  We shall see. 

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4 minutes ago, Maestrobjwa said:

I don't think it was a complete no. Overall colder and further south with the transfer than 0z

 

1 minute ago, SnowenOutThere said:

Still a good trend from the 0z run, has accumulating snow near the Mason-Dixon line instead of in upstate New York. 

Yes true. Big jump south and weaker with the ULL. Just nowhere near as dramatic as GFS.

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1 hour ago, Cobalt said:

The setup leading into it is nowhere near identical (in the sense that we're dealing with a major Midwest storm as depicted on the models) but the lack of major costal development and angle of precipitation as shown on the GFS heavily reminds me of 12/16/10, another event where an episode of blocking was becoming established. To my memory that was a clean 1-3" during the daytime, and a nice early sendoff into the winter break. I have yet to look at the h500 comparisons though, but the PNA was not all that favorable for that month either.

1396780294_ezgif.com-gif-maker(3).gif.6876e9349d8b67e33dd085284a8a1819.gif

 

I'd go with that, around 6" fell out this way if memory serves me well.

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42 minutes ago, WxUSAF said:

 

Yes true. Big jump south and weaker with the ULL. Just nowhere near as dramatic as GFS.

yep--took a closer look. the trend was good but the outcome for 12z was still not what we want but it does look like this coming week will be our first chance for prologned winter weather(more than 10 minutes worth haha)

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9 hours ago, WxUSAF said:

Lol a primary low that takes an Omaha to Chicago track and then becomes a Miller B off Wilmington NC and gives us a MECS :lol:

There's all kinds of weird stuff happening on that run. Look at some stuff going on off the NE coast with lows retrograding/reforming well to the southwest. Pretty wild.

3 hours ago, WEATHER53 said:

Models frequently show a positive outcome from a Miller B for DC area.  They are almost always  wrong as it generally develops too far northeast and maybe Baltimore gets a little, northeast MD more, Philly to NYC a lot. 

I know that folks generally think that Philly gets blasted by Miller Bs, but in reality they usually don't. They do get snow from them, but those storms usually mature too late to get Philly into the good stuff. Better than smoking cirrus like we do, but they don't usually get snows like they do from New York and to the N and NE. 

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3 minutes ago, mattie g said:

There's all kinds of weird stuff happening on that run. Look at some stuff going on off the NE coast with lows retrograding/reforming well to the southwest. Pretty wild.

I know that folks generally think that Philly gets blasted by Miller Bs, but in reality they usually don't. They do get snow from them, but those storms usually mature too late to get Philly into the good stuff. Better than smoking cirrus like we do, but not like they do from New York an tot he N and NE. 

The moral is, the farther N you go generally does better with miller b's. There are exceptions of course like anything but thats a pretty good rule of thumb.

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