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Winter Storm 1/6 - 1/8, 2017


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12 minutes ago, NCSNOW said:

You'll end up fine. I said 5 days ago this would favor 85 east more than 85 west. Cold and high ratios are there, it's all about qpf. Think the gfs is to far south in gom and that's gonna change in one of these next 3 runs it has. So track is gonna be perfect. Big question how much ns phases into lp? 

To emphasize again we'll nail track of LP down, but everyone needs to be very carefull and understand bust potential when your counting on phasing energy between 2 jet streams. 2 cases is Jan 2000 when it worked out great and No one saw it coming and worst case December beleive 2000 maybe 01 or 02, anyway the nws in raleigh, van denton everyone forecasted foot totals and had every model 18 hrs out on board and we woke up to milky skies sun peeking through as the ns was late with the handoff of energy. 

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3 minutes ago, NCSNOW said:

To emphasize again well nail track of LP down, but everyone needs to be very carefull and understand bust potential when your counting on phasing energy between 2 jet streams. 2 cases is Jan 2000 when it worked out great and Noone saw it coming and worst case December beleive 2000 maybe 01 or 02, anyway the news in raleigh, van denton everyone forecasted foot totals and had every model 18 hrs out on board and we woke up to milky skies sun peeking through as the ns was late with the handout of energy. 

What a train wreck that was . 

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7 minutes ago, NCSNOW said:

To emphasize again we'll nail track of LP down, but everyone needs to be very carefull and understand bust potential when your counting on phasing energy between 2 jet streams. 2 cases is Jan 2000 when it worked out great and No one saw it coming and worst case December beleive 2000 maybe 01 or 02, anyway the news in raleigh, van denton everyone forecasted foot totals and had every model 18 hrs out on board and we woke up to milky skies sun peeking through as the ns was late with the handoff of energy. 

Yes, I remember that day well..... Was forecast to get 12-18 inches. Had a nice sunny day!

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1 minute ago, snowlover91 said:

Keep in mind models are also MUCH better than they were in 2000-2002. While they still have problems and known bias they are much improved. If we get a good Miller A track like the UK or Para NAM shows then the moisture won't be a problem. 

   Take a good look at the large-scale features. It just doesn't fit the GFS model out-put. My brain is telling me that there is no way this thing can track that far south. A NW trend has to happen or I haven't learned anything from all these years of reading weather models. The indices alone would argue against a track that far south. If it happens, I will have to re-think my way of discerning weather patterns. Just look at the baroclinic zone that will set up along the coast. That alone should tell you that a storm is most likely to ride that line (AKA zipper low). I might be way off base with this line of thinking, but there have been many case studies on that subject. The temperature gradient alone would suggest a precipitation shield that is more expansive than the one that's being shown. Maybe a Met can chime in with some reasoning....

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55 minutes ago, StoneColdWeatherAustin said:

A couple days ago, there was a lot of chatter about this storm producing high ratio snow so qpf was not as important. Are we still in high ratio thinking?

Sent from my VS990 using Tapatalk
 

Those well away further NW from the low will typically have the better column for higher ratios say 12-15:1 or better but probably only have .10-.25" to work with, those close to the area where it goes from snow to rain will have ratios much lower say 8:1 but have plenty of QPF and then in the middle will be the lucky ones that have temps cold enough for ratios to be 12-13:1 and tons of QPF that will be the happy band...also as the storm ends and the cold rushes in everyone will see better ratios but it will be after 95% of the QPF is used up....this air mass is pretty darn cold though and I would think ratios would be better than normal for a typical SE storm....

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13 minutes ago, CAD_Wedge_NC said:

   Take a good look at the large-scale features. It just doesn't fit the GFS model out-put. My brain is telling me that there is no way this thing can track that far south. A NW trend has to happen or I haven't learned anything from all these years of reading weather models. The indices alone would argue against a track that far south. If it happens, I will have to re-think my way of discerning weather patterns. Just look at the baroclinic zone that will set up along the coast. That alone should tell you that a storm is most likely to ride that line (AKA zipper low). I might be way off base with this line of thinking, but there have been many case studies on that subject. The temperature gradient alone would suggest a precipitation shield that is more expansive than the one that's being shown. Maybe a Met can chime in with some reasoning....

 

Certainly, the GFS is too far south and will adjust north as we get closer. It already started that slightly at 18z and I expect the trend to continue the next 4-5 runs. The most likely track will be along the baroclinic zone if the vort digs like the GFS shows. 

At this range we will want to start watching the mesoscale models as they typically do a much better job picking up on the expanse of the precip shield to the NW and N of the storm. The globals will inside 72 hours. Overall I would say the I-95 corridor has the best chance of seeing 6" or more of snow. 

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4 minutes ago, NCSNOW said:

This is for pack or anyone else who bookmarks model output.

I'd love to see a 72 hour 500 mb animation of the epic GFS run a couple of days ago. The one that dumped 30 inches in central NC. I bet it caught a phase just like the ukie has been doing in about that same area. 

It's easy to do on tropical tidbits, but isn't a good format to post. It was Yesterday's 12z (I know, feels like ages ago).

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6 minutes ago, NCSNOW said:

This is for pack or anyone else who bookmarks model output.

I'd love to see a 72 hour 500 mb animation of the epic GFS run a couple of days ago. The one that dumped 30 inches in central NC. I bet it caught a phase just like the ukie has been doing in about that same area. 

Here's a link. It's a big GIF so it would probably slow the page down if I embedded it. http://imgur.com/a/jx0tt

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7 minutes ago, Jon said:

Here's a link. It's a big GIF so it would probably slow the page down if I embedded it. http://imgur.com/a/jx0tt

Thanks guys, jon. Looked way different than I thought. Crazy trough stayed posotive and our 2cnd wave got left behind in Oregon then just bowling balled right down through the plains and off Ga/Carolina coast. Wasn't even closed off most of the time. Oh well back to the nam.

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Nam inside 48 should be pretty darn accurate and a good indicator if we are going to a EURO type event or if the slower UKmet solution will win out. Will we get the s/w seperation we need? I don't have maps so pls update. Keep it up. You guys are doing great. Very helpful forum

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8 minutes ago, BornAgain13 said:

To me, from what i see on the models, the NS just continues to flatten the wave. I donr know if theirs anyway around that or not.

That's a given now. We want as much left behind as possible don't get me wrong. But it's the energy coming down through the lakes hr 84ish and hoping the weak wave is on the gulf Coast and not halfway to the Yucatan per gfs.

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