CoastalWx Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 I loved this storm. Defintely underrated here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cold Miser Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 B/B+ While I really can't complain about snow fall totals since I ended up being about 20" or so above average. Any other year that would have been awesome. But because of all of the wasted cold, and the numerous cold to mild set ups that ended in rain storms, then back to cold, it's hard not to be a bit bummed out. Jerry and others said way back in the Fall that this would be a cold winter and they were 100% correct. Cold and suppression being the name of the game more than once made it painful sometimes. There will always be a part of me thinking with the "what could have been" mind set. Could this have been a 100" plus snow fall season for many in the SNE region? Possibly, but we will never know. In the end it was not a loss of a winter by any means as I had 100% snow cover for at least 8 weeks during the December 21st to March 19th period. Throw in 10 or so days of coverage at the beginning of Met winter and I would say things were pretty good on the coverage front. Too cold for my taste some days, and too much rain thrown in there as well. B/B+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIPPYVALLEY Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 C here, possibly C-. Will, when you make up your annual sne snowfall map, can you make up a second map showing departures from average? I'd like to think that I'm way below average up here. The only thing that has saved winter for me has been the cold..... Your departures from normal snowfall would probably be much more dramatic relative to a specific 30 day time range average for your area rather than winter as a whole. (eg. January 4 - Feb 4 or Feb 19th - March 19th both were periods that saw under 4" over a 30 day period for almost everyone in Franklin Co. Horrible and thus my C+ grade for winter) January here would have been deplorable without the snow on the 2nd/3rd. Having it come early in the month kept us somewhat near our January average but the 3 weeks that followed were awful. As I said in my earlier post a pretty poor year from N ORH county to the Berkshires and even up into the Monads and S Greens it was nothing to write home about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Your departures from normal snowfall would probably be much more dramatic relative to a specific 30 day time range average for your area rather than winter as a whole. (eg. January 4 - Feb 4 or Feb 19th - March 19th both were periods that saw under 4" over a 30 day period for almost everyone in Franklin Co. Horrible and thus my C+ grade for winter) January here would have been deplorable without the snow on the 2nd/3rd. Having it come early in the month kept us somewhat near our January average but the 3 weeks that followed were awful. As I said in my earlier post a pretty poor year from N ORH county to the Berkshires and even up into the Monads and S Greens it was nothing to write home about. I still find no objective evidence of this. At least anything east of the spine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIPPYVALLEY Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 I still find no objective evidence of this. At least anything east of the spine. Poor may be too strong a term so mediocre but I'm not sure you will hear any arguments from MPM or Dave. Looking at the PNS snowfall reports you can't argue that Franklin County had some pretty bad multi-week stretches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Poor may be too strong a term so mediocre but I'm not sure you will hear any arguments from MPM or Dave. Looking at the PNS snowfall reports you can't argue that Franklin County had some pretty bad multi-week stretches. Well everyone has had bad multi-week stretches. Very hard to find a winter that doesn't. I think that is starting to get subjective on the interpretation. Seasonal snowfall totals are basically dead normal in N ORH county and snowpack days have been slightly above normal despite a volatile ride in December through mid January. Obviously the stretches with no snow or some ill-timed cutters make it "frustrating", but I agree "poor" is definitely too strong of a word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Basically normal snowfall here (average). So a C grade for that Cold gets an A. Boatloads of cold That 1 week in Feb was awesome, with the Whiteouts etc. so an A for that Meh snowpack depth. C there No big storms. B there Cutters in Dec Jan. D there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoarfrostHubb Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 I might end up exactly at my supposed average when all is said and done. Lol. 74.5" attm. I know my sig is not updated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 I still find no objective evidence of this. At least anything east of the spine. I think it's more of the "relative to everyone else around us" type deal...that's why it was painful up here in January and up through Valentines Day here. BTV was only a half foot below average but like that Northeast Regional NWS map showed at one point, BTV was the only climate station below normal north of North Carolina and east of Detroit. It does factor into your overall opinion, as hard as it is to try and not think about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIPPYVALLEY Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Well everyone has had bad multi-week stretches. Very hard to find a winter that doesn't. I think that is starting to get subjective on the interpretation. Seasonal snowfall totals are basically dead normal in N ORH county and snowpack days have been slightly above normal despite a volatile ride in December through mid January. Obviously the stretches with no snow or some ill-timed cutters make it "frustrating", but I agree "poor" is definitely too strong of a word. Being spoiled by several good winters doesn't help me maintain an objective opinion either. Nickel and dime winters inevitably end up underwhelming especially when snow pack retention suffered early on. Again, I've had constant snow cover for months but only due to my microclimate and my grade is for N Franklin Co as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 People grade based on what's happened recently; so if March sucked, they lower their grade. A lot of enthusiasts here are forgetting the magical stretch we had between January 3-February 13, which allowed for snow pack to last well into March. That was one of the best stretches on record for most of our areas, including Brooklyn and Dobbs Ferry where I live. You are always going to get a mediocre period in a winter, as we don't live in the Alps or Labrador, and it just so happened that the mediocre period was recently so we get a deduction of grade. Even in the Alps and Rockies they have mediocre periods. They can go relatively snowless for a month if high pressure anchors in. But what you said about grading based on what happened recently is true, very true. Go back and look at the MET winter grades in that other thread and then this one. The grades in NNE rose and SNE fell, even though we are probably only near normal in snow up here. And SNE is still above normal in the population centers. I'm at 100-110" on the season at home and 250" at the mountain. Average for seasonal (of records we have) is around 125" at home and 315" at the mountain. However, these are recent records. From like mid-90s onward at the mountain and only like 10 years in town. So maybe we are at average right now and recently it's been a snowy period so any 10-20 year average is going to be higher. With that said though, the Mansfield COOP records go back to the 1955 season and if you break it down like JSpin did into recent years and older years, the averages are dead on the same, so maybe the recent averages are legit? Though BTV had its snowiest decade ever from 2000-2010 and those go back to the 1800s. Personally I don't trust the snowfall data from the Mansfield COOP at all, as it's dependent on snow actually falling into a measuring can (wet snows and windless snows are better measured, so if you get a lot of fluff or windy nor'easters, that season will be lower than a season with more cement bombs). I'd say this March raised this winter a full letter grade at least, I'd say B- from a C-. Going -12 for a departure so far this month with almost 3 feet of snowfall at home (69" at 3,000ft stake in three weeks), really has left a good taste in my mouth. One of the least snowiest January's on record at the mountain though hurt the grade a lot and 5 rain storms between Dec 20th and end of January sucked. If a normal winter would be a B- or B, that's pretty much where we are at. The A- to A's are reserved for like 2010-2011 when we got 150" in town and a 42" depth, and A/A+ is for like 2000-2001. So B- seems to fit. If January was even normal snowfall (not above, just normal) we would probably be up in the B+ to A- range. Anyway, this finish has been sweet. Deep deep winter since Feb 14th. Amazing how polar opposite it we are from SNE sometimes...our pain was your gain in the middle of the season, and then it switched at the end. Nice winter evening out there tonight after another well below normal day. The fact that March is colder than February at this point is pretty amazing considering how much normal temps are rising this time of year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginx snewx Posted March 25, 2014 Share Posted March 25, 2014 Buried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Buried What a March...snowiest since March 2007. It was looking like it may just not happen this season, but that definitely helps the overall winter grade. Man that was a rough stretch from mid-Dec to late January and really to Feb 14th. Rough in the terms that we've been spoiled lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powderfreak Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Ginxy...here's your Leon comparison. Overall although I have you crap for that all winter, not a horrible analog. We were lower than that winter and that looked like a pretty epic ending...but this winter dribbled along and then like 93-94 had a strong finish and cold spring. Not to the same magnitude but there are similarities there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wx4cast Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Last two Marches had some decent snows, this year no exception here in Upstate NY. Unlike prior years the winter was below normal but really not extreme. I think prior two winters above normal temperatures and below normal snow fall made folks think this winter was extre me when it wasn't. I would rate it an A- up here. Coming up on 5 straight months of below normal. March the coldest thus far; if we have a top five coldest I go to an A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professional Lurker Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 What is your snowfall total this year? I'd be surprised if you were "way below average"....I'd think around average at worst. Maybe a pinch below. Sorry, I don't have a total that would be accurate enough to give you. Typically I'm pretty much in line with mpm. Sometimes he gets me by s little and sometimes I get him. I think we're pretty equal. Both he and hippy agree that we've had an average winter snowfall wise... If it IS only average subjectively it feels well below. Could be a combo of previous winters setting higher expectations or the many many threats that for one reason or another decided not to produce here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wxmanmitch Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Barring any last minute surprises, I'd give it a C here. I'm at 63.5" which is about 10" below our seasonal average. I've had only 1" for the month of March, which is less than the 4.3" I had in "Morch" of 2012. I think we average close to 13" for the month of March. While not nearly as painful as last winter's epic screw job where ORH had twice our seasonal snowfall, this winter was a bit of a disappointment as well since we missed out on the coastal powder bombs in January, and the NNE storms earlier this month. We had a nice 12" pack in mid-December only to have it wiped out by torches, which resulted in a brown Christmas. January was "meh", and February was a good, but not epic month. March was a frustratingly cold, but dry month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJonesWX Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Basically normal snowfall here (average). So a C grade for that Cold gets an A. Boatloads of cold That 1 week in Feb was awesome, with the Whiteouts etc. so an A for that Meh snowpack depth. C there No big storms. B there Cutters in Dec Jan. D there the cold and the duration of the snowpack are the 2 things that salvage the grade for me. snowfall about 15" above normal, terrific. but the ill-timed torches, and the snowpack depth kill the grade IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRSno Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 C- for BOS, nice totals but never reached it's full potential, especially after 2/18 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weathafella Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 C- for BOS, nice totals but never reached it's full potential, especially after 2/18 While aspects were frustrating, how do you manage to give a winter with subnormal temperatures November thought March and above normal snow for the season a C-? Which winters got A? March pissed me off with the bone chilling cold and paltry 2.2 inches if snow (barring a bit of a miracle prior to 4/1). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoastalWx Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 While aspects were frustrating, how do you manage to give a winter with subnormal temperatures November thought March and above normal snow for the season a C-? Which winters got A? March pissed me off with the bone chilling cold and paltry 2.2 inches if snow (barring a bit of a miracle prior to 4/1). Yeah that's not a fair grade at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdxken Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Yeah that's not a fair grade at all. Where do we stand as far cold for this March, is it in the top ten? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OceanStWx Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Yeah that's not a fair grade at all. 17" above average, sustained cold. Meh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OceanStWx Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Where do we stand as far cold for this March, is it in the top ten? Through the first 26 days BOS is tied for 5th coldest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreaves Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Through the first 26 days BOS is tied for 5th coldest. Does your grade for winter drop the more it eats into golf season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OceanStWx Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Does your grade for winter drop the more it eats into golf season? I have no problems handing out an F if we keep heading in this direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreaves Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 I have no problems handing out an F if we keep heading in this direction. Around this time every year, I head over to the course I play at to see how the snowmelt is coming along. If I get over there this weekend I'll take some pictures and post them so you can feel better about your prospects. The latest opening I can remember is May 3rd or 4th. We might challenge that this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clinch Leatherwood Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 B+. Kept from an A by missed potential and storms that underperformed IMBY like yesterdays along with the rudely timed torches back in January. Cold. Greatest separation in days with true snow cover - the mid Nov event and now late March. That's never happened here. If we had blocking maybe one of these would have been a 100 year storm, but then again if we had blocking a lot of these may have been rain down here. Cohen's work - interesting that the snow cover is more important than the advancement, or at least it was this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORH_wxman Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 B+. Kept from an A by missed potential and storms that underperformed IMBY like yesterdays along with the rudely timed torches back in January. Cold. Greatest separation in days with true snow cover - the mid Nov event and now late March. That's never happened here. If we had blocking maybe one of these would have been a 100 year storm, but then again if we had blocking a lot of these may have been rain down here. Cohen's work - interesting that the snow cover is more important than the advancement, or at least it was this time. It wasn't...they basically chopped down the middle. AO will end up slightly positive for the winter. EPO ridging is what gave us the cold winter in much of the CONUS...not necessarily the AO state. Cohen's work predicts the AO state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TauntonBlizzard2013 Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 B lowered half a letter grade for the last 6 weeks. Don't want to let emotions take over, it was an awesome winter before that. If we continue pretty cold with snow chances for 2-3 more weeks, and don't get one, the grade will drop to a B-, but that's as low as it will go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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