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2013-14 MA Winter Disco - 'cause it's never too early.


Bob Chill

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The nailed. The NAM has no strengths. It's a model designed to always be wrong, so one can know what's not going to happen.

I don't know how it performs in the plains....Is it illogical that a model might be more skilled in the means in another region with a different kind of event?  

 

I'll be sure to use it since it performed well in one discrete May snowstorm in a region nowhere close to the mid-Atlantic

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I don't know how it performs in the plains....Is it illogical that a model might be more skilled in the means in another region with a different kind of event?  

 

I'll be sure to use it since it performed well in one discrete May snowstorm in a region nowhere close to the mid-Atlantic

 

I don't care if you use it or not. That's really up to you. 

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It will be interesting to see what CPC says with its May ENSO update this week. So far every outlook gives the greatest odds of another neutral year. At this point more dynamical models point towards cooling into the fall vs warming. 

 

Latest tri-monthly came in @ -.4. Not much history to go off of but comparing the last 3 tri-monthlies to other similar years points towards a best case weak nino in the 1.0 range. 06-07 & 68-69 managed to do it. 

 

01-02 is in the mix as well from an enso standpoint. That was a neutral winter after 3 ninas in a row. 

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It will be interesting to see what CPC says with its May ENSO update this week. So far every outlook gives the greatest odds of another neutral year. At this point more dynamical models point towards cooling into the fall vs warming. 

 

Latest tri-monthly came in @ -.4. Not much history to go off of but comparing the last 3 tri-monthlies to other similar years points towards a best case weak nino in the 1.0 range. 06-07 & 68-69 managed to do it. 

 

01-02 is in the mix as well from an enso standpoint. That was a neutral winter after 3 ninas in a row. 

we need a Harri-Kari emoticon

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May ENSO update from CPC came out yesterday. The very short version is that all models are still pointing towards neutral down the road. But CPC says its a low confidence forecast because spring is a bad time to predict long lead enso conditions. We have time but unless things start looking up by mid july we'll probably have to accept the fact that another neutral year is on the way and deal with it.
 
Latest 3.4 trimonthly can in @ -0.4. The only Nino's I see on record that came on the heels of similar trimonthlies ended up weak in the 1.0 range.

 

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Enso conditions aren't the absolute factor. They may be a heavy player, but snowfall is very sensitive to the smallest of factors. We were an eyelash from a BIG winter in 10-11. If I remember, that was a Nina?

There are lots of drawbacks to looking way ahead and very little to be gained, other than the fun of curiosity.

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There are lots of drawbacks to looking way ahead and very little to be gained, other than the fun of curiosity.

 

There is very much to be gained. We know exactly when to put Ji on suicide watch. Gotta protect our most amusing winter poster. I think my post might have put his finger on the cancel button. Good thing there is an un-cancel cancel button and a cancel un-cancel cancel un-cancel button. 

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There is very much to be gained. We know exactly when to put Ji on suicide watch. Gotta protect our most amusing winter poster. I think my post might have put his finger on the cancel button. Good thing there is an un-cancel cancel button and a cancel un-cancel cancel un-cancel button.

LOL. If we cancel now, we can always restart it in November.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Screw my life

 

Well friends...

 

Following the wintertime IOSD switch from positive to negative and now the development of a solid -IOD, the tropical forcing cannot get established correctly to produce the WWB needed for an El Niño. We are going to go at least another month of this (mean uplift in traditional La Niña positioning around 120E and waves either enhancing this or somewhat weakening it but not capable of warming ENSO on their own). Also, the solar/QBO aspect favors cooling overall for the next month or so.

 

It is quite possible La Niña will try to fight back. Solar maximum anticipated this year, aiding in warming of the subsidence branch of the Hadley Cells in the Pacific and possibly the equatorial regions. The same can be said with the QBO wave. These things may change in time for winter, but by that point, it may be too late for anything other than a weak-mod La Niña or cold neutral. It does appear that things will probably head toward El Niño next year, assuming the QBO-solar-ENSO system plays out even remotely close to expectations.

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Well friends...

 

Following the wintertime IOSD switch from positive to negative and now the development of a solid -IOD, the tropical forcing cannot get established correctly to produce the WWB needed for an El Niño. We are going to go at least another month of this (mean uplift in traditional La Niña positioning around 120E and waves either enhancing this or somewhat weakening it but not capable of warming ENSO on their own). Also, the solar/QBO aspect favors cooling overall for the next month or so.

 

It is quite possible La Niña will try to fight back. Solar maximum anticipated this year, aiding in warming of the subsidence branch of the Hadley Cells in the Pacific and possibly the equatorial regions. The same can be said with the QBO wave. These things may change in time for winter, but by that point, it may be too late for anything other than a weak-mod La Niña or cold neutral. It does appear that things will probably head toward El Niño next year, assuming the QBO-solar-ENSO system plays out even remotely close to expectations.

ughhh boy...

I guess JI was bound to call one right 6 months before winter begins 

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HM, there really has been no sign of Nino conditions returning since last summer before the rug came out and the odds seem to be increasingly stacked against it. Your post is disheartening of course but far from unexpected. It is what it is.

I suppose we're simply at the mercy of the dominant longwave patterns that will set up and accept the fact that there will be a bias for another year of storms that favor a track n&w of the MA.

I can pick the glass half full side (like I always do. lol) and say that we did have a great 8 week stretch of a lw pattern that would have produced wonderfully if it had happened just a month or 2 earlier. We also had a nice period of extended cold prior to that after the awful pac finally broke down. Winter existed quite well in the MA last year but the ingredients didn't want to work in harmony. Even if we end up with identical enso conditions this year there is no reason to write anything off. The winter may not be laden with juicy miller A's and copious cold but that rarely happens anyway in these parts.

The PDO is definitely in an overall neg regime but it has been relaxing since last fall. The index is basically neutral as of the end of April. I suppose there is an outside chance the phase goes positive during the important months coming up this fall and that could be helpful.

I guess there won't be much to talk about this summer and reasonable expectations for the upcoming winter will be below normal snow and within a degree or 2 of normal for temps for djf. Regardless of ENSO we seem to get some ao/nao love every winter lately.

It can't possibly be as bad as it has been in the snow department the last couple years can it? LOLOL. yes it can...

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