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Mid to Long Term Discussion 2017


buckeyefan1

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4 minutes ago, griteater said:

Extended GFS is pretty much how you would draw up an ideal SE winter storm at 500mb.  Subtropical jet wave undercutting a western ridge and plowing into California, then staying suppressed into the SE due to a heavy block.  It looks like an El Nino pattern really.

Honestly  I agree.  MJO still forecasted to go 3 even though clearly 4. It shall cycle through 4-7/8 in a El nino pattern 

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12 minutes ago, griteater said:

Yeah, the AO and NAO can't be too negative for us in my view.  In the Pacific, I like the mean ridging to be in between the PNA and EPO....so, best to have it in Eastern Alaska and NW Canada

Here's the h500 and surface at 348.  It's a really nice pattern, as you said:

gfs_z500_mslp_nhem_50.thumb.png.bfb9976dce1427cb08cab2dfaa98a4d8.png

gfs_mslp_pcpn_frzn_seus_49.thumb.png.2b877d9ca635d2fe68ce0699e05bb63d.png

 

Would be nice to have that big HP closer in.

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2 minutes ago, SnowNiner said:

Nice. Move this forward into January and I'd be excited (although it's a bit of a east based -NAO right?).  Not expecting winter weather at all in December for CLT. At least it's looking to feel Decemberry, and not Septemberry.   Hopefully this carries over into January. 

gfs-ens_z500a_nhem_44.png

As we all know magic can happen in December. This upcoming pattern could produce. 2010 proved that..  

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12 minutes ago, FallsLake said:

As we all know magic can happen in December. This upcoming pattern could produce. 2010 proved that..  

Yeah, it can happen just not expecting it.  December 2010, I guess you're referencing the Christmas storm? That was late December and CLT kinda got a sloppy mess.  It was great for the mountains and just east of CLT though.  Point taken, it can happen.  My personal experience at my location has been very few and far between.  I think the December 2002 ice storm was the last significant winter weather I've had in December.   

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33 minutes ago, SnowNiner said:

Yeah, it can happen just not expecting it.  December 2010, I guess you're referencing the Christmas storm? That was late December and CLT kinda got a sloppy mess.  It was great for the mountains and just east of CLT though.  Point taken, it can happen.  My personal experience at my location has been very few and far between.  I think the December 2002 ice storm was the last significant winter weather I've had in December.   

I got a little luckier in MBY. Had a few inches of snow in early December, a light icing event in mid December, and then the X-Mas storm. Maybe we can get a storm that affects more on this board.

https://climate.ncsu.edu/climate/winter_wx/database.php

 

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53 minutes ago, SnowNiner said:

Nice. Move this forward into January and I'd be excited (although it's a bit of a east based -NAO right?).  Not expecting winter weather at all in December for CLT. At least it's looking to feel Decemberry, and not Septemberry.   Hopefully this carries over into January. 

gfs-ens_z500a_nhem_44.png

It does look a little east. Ideally it would be better more west. But that's a tall ridge ideally placed out west though.

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29 minutes ago, packbacker said:

When block is east of Greenland I consider that a e-NAO but beggars can't be choosers.   Would prefer it closer to Hudson Bay though :-)

The pattern preceding some of Raleigh's bigger winter events in past Nina's.  

 

 

 

What are the implications of that? You can clearly see the difference in the analog block you posted and the one proposed on the models.  The snowy blocks were near Hudson Bay where the modeled is toward eastern Greenland.  What's the overall benefit of the Hudson block versus what's modeled? Just continuing my education.   

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1 hour ago, SnowNiner said:

What are the implications of that? You can clearly see the difference in the analog block you posted and the one proposed on the models.  The snowy blocks were near Hudson Bay where the modeled is toward eastern Greenland.  What's the overall benefit of the Hudson block versus what's modeled? Just continuing my education.   

Core of cold is located further west...storm track further west too.  I consider what the GEFS is showing more of a neutral NAO though.

Below, core of cold is central/upper plains.  Still a great pattern per the GEFS though.

gefs_t850a_5d_noram_360.png

 

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1 minute ago, griteater said:

For the 11-15 day average, the GFS Ens and Euro Ens are quite similar, but Euro has weaker -NAO block...and CMC Ens has weaker block than Euro Ens.

SE is colder than normal on all 3.  Max cold anomalies are to the west and northwest.

GEFS/EPS are moving towards what you called in your winter outlook though.  Hopefully the Npac ridge is more east based and we can get a weak -NAO. 

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Robert has a good post on Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/WxSouth/

Quote

Long story short, blocking up north, retrograding, and more Greenland Blocking is on the doorstep. This time, with the added benefit of a tall West Coast ridge that could ** thats a maybe ** unite with the overall blocking across the Pole.

 

 

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6z GFS going back to the preferred method of reeling in the cutoff 50/50 low which pulls the blocking ridge back well into Greenland.  0z Euro and yesterday's 18z GFS dumped into the SW low which limits the blocking high's ability to move in.  0z GFS didn't know what to do and didn't dump into either of them.

6z GFS at 204:

iGyb9Yb.png

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1 hour ago, packbacker said:

EPS losing the NAO...higher heights just east of NF.  Getting that 2014 look though...which was probably my favorite winter since 2004.  Not all bad....

Did we really think we wouldn't have to deal with a SER this winter.

 

 

Agreed, higher heights seem to get further and further east everyday.  Boo.  

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15 minutes ago, SnowNiner said:

Agreed, higher heights seem to get further and further east everyday.  Boo.  

Hopefully the Pac is modeled correct with the stout -AO.  If the PV lobe drops in where the GEFS/EPS show it that could result in quite the suppressed storm track like ‘14.  

And now that I jinxed us...

map_btd.png?random=20171128_100239

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