Jump to content
  • Member Statistics

    17,509
    Total Members
    7,904
    Most Online
    joxey
    Newest Member
    joxey
    Joined

February 2022 Obs/Disco


Torch Tiger
 Share

Recommended Posts

Interesting take here from the CPC's MJO desk ... particularly that last paragraph:

• The magnitude of the RMM-based MJO index has increased during early February, with an
enhancement of the intraseasonal signal across the Indian Ocean.
• Dynamical model MJO index forecasts depict a robust MJO event propagating eastward to the
Maritime Continent during the next 2 weeks.
• Based on this predicted MJO and model guidance, the South Indian Ocean is likely to remain
active, with an uptick in activity also possible across the southwest Pacific by the end of February.
• Given the increasing likelihood that the MJO constructively interferes with La Niña, an atmospheric
response typical of La Niña is expected across the mid-latitudes of the North Pacific and North
America during the latter half of February and into early March.

We just spent 6 weeks in a relative decoupled state between the observed mode of circulation wrt to La Nina.  Why does that necessitate we suddenly see some blissful reunited ('and it feels so good') state of affairs, now?

The difference there, as written.. might be as intimated, because momentum through Phases 3 - late 6, constructively interferes with the La Nina base state...

The only problem there is, that is in direct conflict with the present PNA modalities from both the GEFs and EPS sources.   -EPO notwithstanding...  It's like their "expectation" is/was divorced(ing) from acknowledging these current prognostic tools. 

Not sure how to reconcile that... 

Ray's got some stat-based ideas on what the pattern may offer with nuances in the ENSO etc..., that more than less 'fit' those +PNA/ vestigial -EPO modes we see coming from the EOFs.   This is the interesting aspect ...  IF their take above occurs, what do they anticipate the pattern to become in a more proficiently coupled state?    If it couples, and Ray is right...it would only add to a amplitude that does not fit Phases 3- late 6.  So everything appears to be in some sort of contradictory ...or competing conceptual circumstance.   Wtf -

The whole thing seems like be a bag of voodoo as Scott likes to say ...  Part of the problem I have with MJO and always have, and have railed about this popsicle headache for years.   THE MJO DOES NOT DRIVE THE PATTERN.  The pattern may be reinforced, positively or negatively, but the MJO can exist in a given phase state and it means nothing anywhere, just as much as everywhere may look like it owes its circumstance entirely to it.  Not sure how one can really tell which is which and decompose qualitatively, the amounts.  

The only reason I'm bringing it up and laboring through prose no one will read ... is because others keep bandying the MJO prominence...And want people to pump those breaks.   We don't know what the p.o.s. is going to mean.  If it couples up with La Lina and together forces a pattern, the signal can go either direction based on the positive interference...so it does pretty much nothing to clarify jack shit.   

  • Thanks 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Typhoon Tip said:

Interesting take here from the CPC's MJO desk ... particularly that last paragraph:

• The magnitude of the RMM-based MJO index has increased during early February, with an
enhancement of the intraseasonal signal across the Indian Ocean.
• Dynamical model MJO index forecasts depict a robust MJO event propagating eastward to the
Maritime Continent during the next 2 weeks.
• Based on this predicted MJO and model guidance, the South Indian Ocean is likely to remain
active, with an uptick in activity also possible across the southwest Pacific by the end of February.
• Given the increasing likelihood that the MJO constructively interferes with La Niña, an atmospheric
response typical of La Niña is expected across the mid-latitudes of the North Pacific and North
America during the latter half of February and into early March.

We just spent 6 weeks in a relative decoupled state between the observed mode of circulation wrt to La Nina.  Why does that necessitate we suddenly see some blissful reunited ('and it feels so good') state of affairs, now?

The difference there, as written.. might be as intimated, because momentum through Phases 3 - late 6, constructively interferes with the La Nina base state...

The only problem there is, that is in direct conflict with the present PNA modalities from both the GEFs and EPS sources.   -EPO notwithstanding...  It's like their "expectation" is/was divorced(ing) from acknowledging these current prognostic tools. 

Not sure how to reconcile that... 

Ray's got some stat-based ideas on what the pattern may offer with nuances in the ENSO etc..., that more than less 'fit' those +PNA/ vestigial -EPO modes we see coming from the EOFs.   This is the interesting aspect ...  IF their take above occurs, what do they anticipate the pattern to become in a more proficiently coupled state?    If it couples, and Ray is right...it would only add to a amplitude that does not fit Phases 3- late 6.  So everything appears to be in some sort of contradictory ...or competing conceptual circumstance.   Wtf -

The whole thing seems like be a bag of voodoo as Scott likes to say ...  Part of the problem I have with MJO and always have, and have railed about this popsicle headache for years.   THE MJO DOES NOT DRIVE THE PATTERN.  The pattern may be reinforced, positively or negatively, but the MJO can exist in a given phase state and it means nothing anywhere, just as much as everywhere may look like it owes its circumstance entirely to it.  Not sure how one can really tell which is which and decompose qualitatively, the amounts.  

The only reason I'm bringing it up and laboring through prose no one will read ... is because others keep bandying the MJO prominence...And want people to pump those breaks.   We don't know what the p.o.s. is going to mean.  If it couples up with La Lina and together forces a pattern, the signal can go either direction based on the positive interference...so it does pretty much nothing to clarify jack shit.   

John, I have noticed that all of the government agencies take a very lazy approach to la nina...especially with respect to longer lead times. Its always base-state, generic la nina climo....cold nw, warm SE, blah, blah. I understand that we don't have big blocking, so there is a risk, as Scott points out so diligently and incessantly, but I think they need to be a little more open minded with respect to these ENSO climo conceptualizations.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Remember all of those generic, cookie-cutter, blowtorch ratter winter outlooks? This is why I knew this winter wouldn't be like that (shit interior SNE/CNE snow luck not withstanding), just as I knew 2017-2018 winter wouldn't. Not all la ninas are the same....some are stronger, some are weaker, some are more modoki, some or more east based, some are in the middle.....some are strongly coupled, some less coupled.

It was always apparent that this would be near the threshold of weak-moderate, well coupled on average (yes, some variation) and biased somewhat to the east. Anyone with this insight and unlimited access to the data would not have forecast a generic la nina season.

Period-

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, 40/70 Benchmark said:

John, I have noticed that all of the government agencies take a very lazy approach to la nina...especially with respect to longer lead times. Its always base-state, generic la nina climo....cold nw, warm SE, blah, blah. I understand that we don't have big blocking, so there is a risk, as Scott points out so diligently and incessantly, but I think they need to be a little more open minded about this ENSO climo.

yeah perhaps

 ... meanwhile, ENSO climo is under attack by a propensity and increasing one at that, for these decoupling eras ...

It only obfuscates this further.   

I mentioned yesterday that I don't really have a feel, warm or cool, for March beyond about the 5th of the month.  I don't see the EPS' veiny erection of heights over western Canada as being entirely stable in the guidance beyond the time frame.  If this were January, perhaps... but we battle CC-related earlier break downs of seasonality, combined with experimental statistical inference... combine (enter plausibility) ... 

I could see getting next Friday... then a big one early March that sort of is like 2014 ?   It was like the last thing that season did and week later we we were doing 60s with Forsythias.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, MJO812 said:

12z Euro cooled off compared to 0z

It's a week out....meaningless at this point. But the pattern def favors a colder type overrunning storm with that monster EPO ridge displaced a bit east which is supporting a monster 1040+ high over Ontario/Quebec.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, ORH_wxman said:

It's a week out....meaningless at this point. But the pattern def favors a colder type overrunning storm with that monster EPO ridge displaced a bit east which is supporting a monster 1040+ high over Ontario/Quebec.

Two "monster" references in one post from you...not a bad omen.

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, mreaves said:

For me, the bigger issue comes from tracks that get frozen into the trail.  I hate getting stuck in frozen ski ruts.  Seems like you are always wrestling to keep the sled going the way you want rather following someone else's tracks.

I have snow trackers. It goes where you aim it, although they are not great in looser snow.  But ruts may be a bigger issue than tall carbides solve.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, weatherwiz said:

:lol:

Been pretty busy and there hasn't been much going on locally...and I've been spending some free time digging into the Northeast Snowstorm volumes. 

Great, you can see all the Miller As that produced from The south or Mid Atlantic up through Maine...storms of yesteryear

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, mreaves said:

For me, the bigger issue comes from tracks that get frozen into the trail.  I hate getting stuck in frozen ski ruts.  Seems like you are always wrestling to keep the sled going the way you want rather following someone else's tracks.

Get yourself a pair of snow trackers, You will never have the problem again with other peoples tracks or darting.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 minutes ago, cleetussnow said:

I have snow trackers. It goes where you aim it, although they are not great in looser snow.  But ruts may be a bigger issue than tall carbides solve.  

Just saw this, Yes i as well have them, The rail on hard pack or firm trails but push a bit into corners but still better then reg carbides.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, CoastalWx said:

Lots of run to run changes at H5 over western NAMR which I suppose is not a surprise with this look. Nothing bad..but placement of the ridge near the PNA domain or EPO domain will matter.

Well, it is bad if its more near the EPO domain because its probably more of a NNE pattern, with cold between rainers. That was 2018-2019. I know by 
"bad" you mean warm, but to me, bad is cold-rain-cold-rain.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, 40/70 Benchmark said:

Well, it is bad if its more near the EPO domain because its probably more of a NNE pattern, with cold between rainers. That was 2018-2019. I know by 
"bad" you mean warm, but to me, bad is cold-rain-cold-rain.

I know what you mean, but the placement of the ridge matters....you can have snowy looks there too if it can really fold into the polar domain.

 

But yes, I am with you to a point.....I want to see that more near western NAMR. The EPS of all guidance is most favorable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, CoastalWx said:

I know what you mean, but the placement of the ridge matters....you can have snowy looks there too if it can really fold into the polar domain.

 

But yes, I am with you to a point.....I want to see that more near western NAMR. The EPS of all guidance is most favorable.

I'd rather not rely in the ridge extending through the north pole.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, CoastalWx said:

Lots of run to run changes at H5 over western NAMR which I suppose is not a surprise with this look. Nothing bad..but placement of the ridge near the PNA domain or EPO domain will matter.

Ridge is def further east on this EPS run for the pattern post-2/25. Then it retrogrades a bit back but into an excellent position still and it's associated with split flow.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...