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December 2021 General Discussion


Hoosier
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3 hours ago, michsnowfreak said:

Chicago's 1961-90 normals, which was the coldest 30 year period on record in chicago, are 2゚colder than 1991-2020, at least using the raw data, not 4°.

 

Regardless, after a snowy Thanksgivimg weekend here December was trash. Here's hoping the long range models are right for a wintry January.

I am talking about DJF (and mainly J), not just December. Sorry for not clarifying. Either way, even 2F masks the true situation on that map…and 2F is still a huge change over 30 years. Yes, some is UHI…but it has happened either way. 
 

And it doesn’t matter that 1961-90 was the coldest 30-year period. That is what I grew up with, so it’s my minimum expectation. My ire isn’t directed at you - it’s just out of frustration. 
 

At ORD, January normal temp used to be around 21F, now it’s near 25F, give or take. When you’re on the wrong side of the Midwest winter gradient like we are, every degree matters to retain snowpack. 

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A mild 29 degrees this evening after receiving 4.1" of 18:1 ratio snow from 3:30-7 tonight. Forecast called for a 40% chance of snow with less than a half an inch.  Never even got an SPS.

Warm day tomorrow around 35 with some mixed precip.

December at MQT 36"

MBY over 40".

19 days this month with at least a trace and 15 days with measurable snow

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6 hours ago, beavis1729 said:

I am talking about DJF (and mainly J), not just December. Sorry for not clarifying. Either way, even 2F masks the true situation on that map…and 2F is still a huge change over 30 years. Yes, some is UHI…but it has happened either way. 
 

And it doesn’t matter that 1961-90 was the coldest 30-year period. That is what I grew up with, so it’s my minimum expectation. My ire isn’t directed at you - it’s just out of frustration. 
 

At ORD, January normal temp used to be around 21F, now it’s near 25F, give or take. When you’re on the wrong side of the Midwest winter gradient like we are, every degree matters to retain snowpack. 

I always thought you were around the same age as me (I'm 38). if you want to talk about what we "grew up with" Winters today for the most part are superior to the winters of my middle school & high school days in the 1990s.  I was not yet born when the brutal cold of the 1970s masked averages.

Here are Chicago's 30 year DJF normals. As I said, it is 2゚ not 4゚ colder, and as you see 1961-90 sticks out like a sore, cold thumb.

1881-10: 25.7
1891-20: 25.9
1901-30: 26.8
1911-40: 27.9
1921-50: 28.1
1931-60: 28.0
1941-70: 26.8
1951-80: 26.0
1961-90: 25.1
1971-00: 25.9
1981-10: 26.3
1991-20: 27.1

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8 minutes ago, michsnowfreak said:

I always thought you were around the same age as me (I'm 38). if you want to talk about what we "grew up with" Winters today for the most part are superior to the winters of my middle school & high school days in the 1990s.  I was not yet born when the brutal cold of the 1970s masked averages.

Here are Chicago's 30 year DJF normals. As I said, it is 2゚ not 4゚ colder, and as you see 1961-90 sticks out like a sore, cold thumb.

1881-10: 25.7
1891-20: 25.9
1901-30: 26.8
1911-40: 27.9
1921-50: 28.1
1931-60: 28.0
1941-70: 26.8
1951-80: 26.0
1961-90: 25.1
1971-00: 25.9
1981-10: 26.3
1991-20: 27.1

Winter is really not starting before January lately. There's no ice on the lakes.

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9 minutes ago, michsnowfreak said:

Today DTW finally fell below average for season snow to date, standing at 7.8" on the season and 8.0" being normal to date

Ran into a nice burst of snow falling downtown Plymouth yesterday about 7:30 am on my way to the office. It was solidly in the 20's and not melting at all. Had a brief coating and nice flake size. Reminder of what actual December can look like, lol. M-59 is the current divide between the gets, and the get-nots. Hope this crap ends soon, despite what the dearth darlings of Chicago are cheering on.

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1 hour ago, michsnowfreak said:

I always thought you were around the same age as me (I'm 38). if you want to talk about what we "grew up with" Winters today for the most part are superior to the winters of my middle school & high school days in the 1990s.  I was not yet born when the brutal cold of the 1970s masked averages.

Here are Chicago's 30 year DJF normals. As I said, it is 2゚ not 4゚ colder, and as you see 1961-90 sticks out like a sore, cold thumb.

1881-10: 25.7
1891-20: 25.9
1901-30: 26.8
1911-40: 27.9
1921-50: 28.1
1931-60: 28.0
1941-70: 26.8
1951-80: 26.0
1961-90: 25.1
1971-00: 25.9
1981-10: 26.3
1991-20: 27.1

Are those all ORD? I thought the early years were right by the lake until MDW became the official site in 1940 maybe. I only bring it up because temps stay warmer by the lake in the early winter 

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8 hours ago, Danny8 said:

Are those all ORD? I thought the early years were right by the lake until MDW became the official site in 1940 maybe. I only bring it up because temps stay warmer by the lake in the early winter 

https://www.weather.gov/lot/observation_history

 

Here's your answer, moved to Midway in 1942 and O'Hare in 1980.   Puts those really warm temps back in the first half of the 20th century in much better perspective

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1 minute ago, A-L-E-K said:

rolling into 2022 with nothing but zzzzzz in the extended

futility talk going to start ramping up as we progress into january snowless

Not really seeing much of a pattern change early January. If there's a cold push SE it's crawling. Mean storm track still seems Colorado to Chicago or NW. Good for northern lakes as Chistorm said Minn/Wi/MI

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3 minutes ago, Chicago Storm said:


Not our region, but Denver is still sitting at only 0.3” on the season as well.


.

That's pretty impressive/depressing.  This is starting to get pretty crazy now, as usually if a location is in futility at this point in the season it's sort of an area that has been getting screwed.  This futility is very widespread this season.  The areas not in futility are actually in the minority it would seem.

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12 hours ago, Danny8 said:

Are those all ORD? I thought the early years were right by the lake until MDW became the official site in 1940 maybe. I only bring it up because temps stay warmer by the lake in the early winter 

 It is wherever the official site is at that time. Site location, surroundings, radiating, UHI all play factors but they are what the official data is.

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40 out right now on a mild Christmas eve day. Chilly tomorrow, but normal temps, with a good snowstorm slated for Sun night into Mon. Then possibly another strong hit Tues into Wed. E/NE winds going to jack up are snow totals around here. Need it to bring back the snow depth for the upcoming cold weather. :) 

Sorry, not trying to rub it in or anything. I know you guys in the southern areas are chomping at the bit.

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