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Dec 11-13 MW/Lakes/OV Snow Event?


Chicago Storm

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wtf... am taking a better look at the thermal fields with the GGEM, but can't help noticing that it tries to occlude the primary in literally just under 12 hours after it comes out of the lee-side trough. Seems a little ridiculous, even for rapid cyclogenesis.

I'm at home, so I don't have the best access to model data, but are we looking at an instant occlusion situation? Seems like a candidate considering the origin of the primary low.

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I'm at home, so I don't have the best access to model data, but are we looking at an instant occlusion situation? Seems like a candidate considering the origin of the primary low.

Ah yes. It does indeed appear to be doing this, or something close to it, from looking at the 700/500mb levels more closely. Could explain the massive, dominant trowal on this system.

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What a mess.

Literally.

As always the best chances of snow will be "north" probably I-80 corridor.

However, as pointed out by some people much smarter then me. the jet orientation would suggest a shot for a major ice storm along the I-780 corridor with cold air entranced under the occluded low assuming it is not in Michigan. Also we have no idea yet what the 1st system will do.

We also can't say what the massive snow pack will do, so far models are busting warm all over the place.

Mostly it blows to have models go past 84 hours. Sure would make life for me easier if they stopped there. and we could extrapolate instead of having guidance possibly give us bogus ideas. Guess it's not as bad for those not as emotionally invested in the outcome. I honestly would take 2 inches of snow becuase I just want to see how cold we can get after this with snow cover.

gonna take a bit to see this start to come together, but I wouldn't bank on anyone along or south of 70 getting a big snow storm, we all have been tracking this for a long time and most of the time North is right.

From Chris Higgins, Met in STL.

Upon further review... the new EURO portrays a classic winter storm for the STL area...with an inverted trough extending north from a wave on the stalled arctic front in southern plains. It spins up a new and powerful surface low at the triple point in AR and lifts it east/northeast up the ohio river....along a classic memphis low track..with the 500mb low centered over or just south of STL by 12z sunday. Taken strictly at face value, the EURO implies near blizzard conditions for much of MO spreading into IL during the day Sunday.

On the flip side... the candian is MUCH further north...even further north than the old Euro was. It has a much flatter west to east upper flow and shows far less digging. The canadian ensembles show a massive spread in solutions indicating a high confusion level within the model. The GFS ensembles are all over the place as well. However, both model ensembles do have several members that support the latest Euro solution.

So the H5 low is close or south of KSTL?

but the surface low is hundreds of miles north?

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So we have the Euro going far north, the GEM is similar but it tracks in more of an easterly direction. The 12z GFS is pseudo-miller B (i think?)....so much for model agreement :arrowhead:

I don't like having the Euro/GEM against me, but I have to think they will trend back south a bit. Just probably a bit north of what the GFS shows. Or maybe it will be the first time ever we don't see a NW trend from the GFS :axe::lmao:

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Just recently posted from Tom Skilling on Tweeter:

Modest snow/sleet system due Thu--but this coming weekend's system looking mean for the Midwest--potentially a full blown winter storm.

Latest 2 wk computer snowfall estimates here range from 5.2 to as much as 16.6" on the most recent 7 runs of the Wx Svc's GFS forecast model

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So we have the Euro going far north, the GEM is similar but it tracks in more of an easterly direction. The 12z GFS is pseudo-miller B (i think?)....so much for model agreement :arrowhead:

I don't like having the Euro/GEM against me, but I have to think they will trend back south a bit. Just probably a bit north of what the GFS shows. Or maybe it will be the first time ever we don't see a NW trend from the GFS :axe::lmao:

Yep ever since Hoosier said models were in agreement things exploded :P

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Not good for Se MI. Typical models showing a monster in the carolinas and moving it NW ever so slowly. The block is weak so I dont think anything is preventing this thing from cutting north.

Unless the polar vortex drops south more, that will keep it from cutting north some.

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