October Banter/ Disco

[CoastalWx]

I'd like the PV right over us this winter... I want High temps of 2 degrees. with lows in the negative teens.

btw scott, when was the last major arctic outbreak? I'm talking like top 10 events.

LOL, no it means potential vorticity in this case. Just giving him some crap.

Well off the top of my head, the Jan '09 outbreak was probably the last real good one, although I did get below 0 last winter once. For me, nothing compares to the Jan '04 event. That was brutal, brutal cold when you take into account the longevity.

[weatherMA]

Yeah, early mid Nov seems more realistic... Will probably has the avg first flakes forxevery ASOS memorized

I got 2 events in Oct 2009, the 16th and 18th. 2" out of one

Yeah 10/16 there was a coating on the grass when I went to the bus stop that morning.

10/18 was the Sunday afternoon when I got .5"...huge parachutes that would not accumulate on the wet ground. The first one flurries were forecast. The second one was supposed to be a rainy afternoon except for maybe high elevation. Both were wrong.

[HoarfrostHubb]

LOL, no it means potential vorticity in this case. Just giving him some crap.

Well off the top of my head, the Jan '09 outbreak was probably the last real good one, although I did get below 0 last winter once. For me, nothing compares to the Jan '04 event. That was brutal, brutal cold when you take into account the longevity.

After Will mentioned it a few weeks ago, I read up on Dec 1988. That was insane

But Jan 2004 was good. -18F imby

[HoarfrostHubb]

Ophelia is quite the lil storm

[snowNH]

LOL, no it means potential vorticity in this case. Just giving him some crap.

Well off the top of my head, the Jan '09 outbreak was probably the last real good one, although I did get below 0 last winter once. For me, nothing compares to the Jan '04 event. That was brutal, brutal cold when you take into account the longevity.

I seriously can't wait till were tracking our first major snow storm. There was nothing like boxing day last year. I doubt we'll see snow packs equivalent to last year though.

[Mr Torchey]

58

south wind dp up to 52

The jets are in trouble, both o and d lines are decimated, no pass rush, no running game and Sanchez is feeling the pressure. COngrats Patriots

[CT Rain]

Ryan has a PV fetish.

lol

[CT Rain]

LOL, no it means potential vorticity in this case. Just giving him some crap.

Well off the top of my head, the Jan '09 outbreak was probably the last real good one, although I did get below 0 last winter once. For me, nothing compares to the Jan '04 event. That was brutal, brutal cold when you take into account the longevity.

Yeah Jan 04 was awful. Particularly in BOS. Love the -30c 850 isotherm flirting with BOS.

[CoastalWx]

After Will mentioned it a few weeks ago, I read up on Dec 1988. That was insane

But Jan 2004 was good. -18F imby

I think you meant Dec '89??

[CoastalWx]

Yeah Jan 04 was awful. Particularly in BOS. Love the -30c 850 isotherm flirting with BOS.

Yeah all the snow kept missing us. I had mostly bare ground in that. Lots of shrubs had winter burn.

[HIPPYVALLEY]

I specialize in QC...I consult in that work, even overseas. I do this all the time.

I don't need anecdotel evidence when people dispute me. I use real data when doing it and a knowledge of the atmosphere at the time of the data in question. Saying that 1060 feet just ENE of Peru at 2000 feet (who had a high of 55F) in a relatively uniform atmosphere is a very easy call. Maybe they hit 57F...that is not horribly far off, but using an inferior thermometer reading from a volkswagon jetta or anecdotel evidence is worth nearly nothing to me. Saying they had the same reading as a place not far at 2k in this atmosphere setup is an easy cross-off.

I do not mean to be harsh, but every time someone wants to dispute QC with me, I will ask for real data that is actually worth something.

Not disputing the raw data but I've lived all over New England (Cambridge Ma, Kingfield Me, Falmouth Ma, Montpelier Vt, and now Greenfield ) and i will say I have never seen such wide variations in precipitation and temperatures over such short distances as I've seen out in W. Ma./Ct River Valley. Unfortunately there are not official stations everywhere.

I had over 5" of precipitation this week in the rain gauge when most local (10 mi.) Wunderground stations had 3" or so. MPM will back me up on this.

54/53 here right now which is lower than many of the surrounding Wunderground sites.

[CT Rain]

I think you meant Dec '89??

Dec 89 was insane cold. The anomalies for the month were about as high as you can get.

[TalcottWx]

59/58, not a bad night. In between being raw and being humid.

I can't wait for winter. Only 4 weeks until we can realistically look for first flakes!

I wont see flakes until december.. pathetic.. im home from dec 22nd ish to like almost february at least

[HoarfrostHubb]

I think you meant Dec '89??

Yup... mis-typed.

-12F monthly departure for ORH

[snowNH]

Has there ever been a major storm before lets say Dec. 1? Like 12"+ for BOS

[Logan11]

It was the classic winter collapse right after the New Year. People were using that as an example of how this past winter was supposed to implode and end after a cold December. That didn't quite work out.

I remember I was at one of the malls in Paramus, NJ and I am in the car listening to a countdown of the top hits of the 80's and thinking how could the 80's be over...went so fast. Anyway it was bitter cold hard core winter even down there, but it all collapsed a week later.

Dec 89 was insane cold. The anomalies for the month were about as high as you can get.

[dendrite]

Has there ever been a major storm before lets say Dec. 1? Like 12"+ for BOS

BOS had one in 1898 in late Nov. There's been a few at CON/ORH.

[snowNH]

BOS had one in 1898 in late Nov. There's been a few at CON/ORH.

Wow I thought there would be a lot more than that.. That's pretty crazy

[HIPPYVALLEY]

LOL let's hope New England's winter doesn't collapse like the Red Sox this year.

It was the classic winter collapse right after the New Year. People were using that as an example of how this past winter was supposed to implode and end after a cold December. That didn't quite work out.

I remember I was at one of the malls in Paramus, NJ and I am in the car listening to a countdown of the top hits of the 80's and thinking how could the 80's be over...went so fast. Anyway it was bitter cold hard core winter even down there, but it all collapsed a week later.

[weatherMA]

I wont see flakes until december.. pathetic.. im home from dec 22nd ish to like almost february at least

You probably won't see any snow at all in Towson. They'll get 1" on 12/27 and 3" on 1/17 and that'll be it for the year. You'll miss the whole "winter."

[HIPPYVALLEY]

BOS had one in 1898 in late Nov. There's been a few at CON/ORH.

Seems like early season dumps are much more rare than late season in SNE.

[dendrite]

For me, nothing compares to the Jan '04 event. That was brutal, brutal cold when you take into account the longevity.

I loved Jan 2004. There were back to back days that month with below zero highs up here. Then there was a below zero snow event and one last strong CAA push where I had snow squalls with temps in the -10s. I felt like I was in Yellowknife or something.

[dendrite]

Seems like early season dumps are much more rare than late season in SNE.

Well I think the 8.9" on 11/11-12/1987 deserves mention. It isn't 12+, but that's impressive for 1/3 into Nov at Logan. PVD had 8.0".

[CT Rain]

I loved Jan 2004. There were back to back days that month with below zero highs up here. Then there was a below zero snow event and one last strong CAA push where I had snow squalls with temps in the -10s. I felt like I was in Yellowknife or something.

I think I'd prefer back-to-back 100+ highs lol.

Jan 14, 2004 was BDLs last sub 10F high

[CT Rain]

1/16/94 was a nice cold day at BDL -8/+6 on the day lol

[ski MRG]

I've got your back on this one. Sheet drizzle and steady light rain here all day. Picked up another 1/8" of rain.

Went to Garlic and Arts up in the hills of Orange/New Salem. Cool and overcast but less rain and blissed out hippies young and old enjoying the day.

Car temp was 54 when we got there.

LOL. No way dude. All of our thermometers, whether they be in a car or properly sited must be wrong. The fact of the matter is the clouds and rain held tough all day. I hit 56 but that was with the benefit of the showers slipping just to the north and the skies brightening. It was raw and misty from Conway north. I totally believe that MPM likely remained at 55 in that bank of sheet drizzle and rain. But hey, what do we know, we just live here.

[ski MRG]

65

mostly sunny, was a spectacular day

as expected the Bill are an awful team.

Wow, the Jets look awful. The Ravens are eating them alive. What a terrible effort.

[dryslot]

go pats

[ORH_wxman]

Not disputing the raw data but I've lived all over New England (Cambridge Ma, Kingfield Me, Falmouth Ma, Montpelier Vt, and now Greenfield ) and i will say I have never seen such wide variations in precipitation and temperatures over such short distances as I've seen out in W. Ma./Ct River Valley. Unfortunately there are not official stations everywhere.

I had over 5" of precipitation this week in the rain gauge when most local (10 mi.) Wunderground stations had 3" or so. MPM will back me up on this.

54/53 here right now which is lower than many of the surrounding Wunderground sites.

We were disputing high temps today.

Believe me, I am not unfamiliar with terrain variations, I constantly go up to weenie ridge at elevations near 1500 feet and know the differences that happen. They can be staggering. Today though, it was pretty obvious that a 55F was just about impossible at 1060 feet based on reliable data. Data doesn't have to be reliable just because its there.

This is where QC comes in. I've often had my car thermo run warm in ORH due to more urban setting and then it actually runs cold if I went up to 1400 feet in Princeton....I noticed this in October 2009 during that snow event. Temps can be affected by a lot of variables...that is where knowledge of the type of lapse rate and atmosphere we have at the present comes in handy in verifying temps. This is how NCDC verifiies their temps too...they just do not take wundground temps and when one hits a big mark, they call it a state record, they QC it. Some are more reliable than others even if they are all in the "ball park".

This is where I am nitpicking. We are talking the difference between 55F and 57F....not the difference between 55F and 65F. When people say "you do not live here and do not know what its like" to me, it will set me off a bit, because I know that feeling and already understand it. I take that into account. I have forecasted for the Berkshires before. I know their climate. I know how much difference can happen with a few hundred feet...it happens here in the ORH hills too. Just ask weatherMA in the Feb 24, 2010 storm when I was posting pics of a foot of paste when he had 5" of slop. But it takes very well known atmospheric setups for those differences to become so extreme.

This atmosphere wasn't like that and it was supported by the reliable data we have at 2000 feet in the Berkshires. Even Pete himself agreed (maybe unknowingly) saying his high was between 56-57F at 1400 feet.

[H2Otown_WX]

I think you meant Dec '89??

I think December 1988 was cold too though right? My brother was born on 12/9/88 and my father claims it was a brutally cold day with highs in the single digits.