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Possible strong/super El Niño forming?


snowman19

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Just an amazing amount of SST warmth for the Nino 4 region.

 

attachicon.gifpac_oisst_current.png

 

 

 

The absolute temperatures translate to SST's of around 86.5-87F in that region, when typically, the normal is closer to 83F, and in more robust La Nina years, can probably fall below 80F in spots. Given we're talking about an already very high temperature, the difference between 80F water and 87F water is significant [proof is behavior of cyclones over each], with the latter possessing much more available potential energy. This energy is often manifested in the development of tropical convection, from which, the heat is transferred into the atmosphere.

 

That image demonstrates why the tropical Pacific contains much more value than the NE PAC; waters of 11C do not have the capability of significantly influencing deep convective processes. They can induce positive feedback loops in which pressures are raised or lowered in a relative sense, but the tropics govern the atmospheric pattern over that domain for the most part.

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This is truly fascinating. I really had doubted this, but it's happening. I can't wait to see the true results of this westward shift. 

 

Persistence based forecasting seems to really be the way to go with this El Nino. Over the last 3 months, the pattern has been remarkably consistent focusing the highest reductions in the trade winds relative to average W. of 120 W. Looks like this reduction in the trade winds will be no different. 

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Persistence based forecasting seems to really be the way to go with this El Nino. Over the last 3 months, the pattern has been remarkably consistent focusing the highest reductions in the trade winds relative to average W. of 120 W. Looks like this reduction in the trade winds will be no different. 

Not only that, but the blue colors to the east should signal another drop in ENSO 1.2 in the near future, which is good news. Relax Global Warmer, I see the light yellows before the blues!  ;)

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Very encouraging developments indeed with the continued westward shift of the warmest anomalies. Dateline forcing is all but assured now. Anyone else have the feeling a prolific winter event is in the offing in the coming months? After all an El Nino such as this one with favorable forcing, one would think simply wouldn't just disappear into the night without repercussions.

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Very encouraging developments indeed with the continued westward shift of the warmest anomalies. Dateline forcing is all but assured now. Anyone else have the feeling a prolific winter event is in the offing in the coming months? After all an El Nino such as this one with favorable forcing, one would think simply wouldn't just disappear into the night without repercussions.

Nothing is assured in weather
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I think 3.4 gets to plus 3c before this quits and just wow at seeing plus 1.7c in R4 , that`s epic .

No wonder why the forcing is just shunted out that way , the D/L region is on fire .

If I'm not mistaken the warmest reading ever on record for 3.4 is +2.9C, hit during the 82-83 Nino. I agree that we see this one break that record at +3C, possibly even higher by December....
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If I'm not mistaken the warmest reading ever on record for 3.4 is +2.9C, hit during the 82-83 Nino. I agree that we see this one break that record at +3C, possibly even higher by December....

 

 

I think 3  3.4 and 4 run into mid Dec .    We broke R4 I think we break 3.4 as well . 

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Very encouraging developments indeed with the continued westward shift of the warmest anomalies. Dateline forcing is all but assured now. Anyone else have the feeling a prolific winter event is in the offing in the coming months? After all an El Nino such as this one with favorable forcing, one would think simply wouldn't just disappear into the night without repercussions.

 

Don't agree...forcing will be between 140-160...the core anomalies are too far east...It isn't like this magically became a west based Nino...biggest anomalies are near 120

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Quick Question:

 

Are the region temperatures that are recorded simply the highest in that region, or are they the average of the temperatures in that entire region?

 

 

They're a mean of SST's in that geographic region. Region 4 is a rather expansive area that stretches from 160E to approximately 150W. Thus, there are SST's both higher and lower than the recorded mean. Parts of region 4 currently have values of 31C.

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Persistence based forecasting seems to really be the way to go with this El Nino. Over the last 3 months, the pattern has been remarkably consistent focusing the highest reductions in the trade winds relative to average W. of 120 W. Looks like this reduction in the trade winds will be no different. 

 

You can see how the 925 mb winds  in October E of 140W favored the warmer west scenario that we are seeing now instead of the east-based 1997.

 

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You can't find an indicator in favor of a positive AO/NAO, aside from the el nino intensity.

Read HM's new tweet and retweet. There is a very strong stratospheric polar vortex right now that is forecast to get even stronger. That definitely does not bode well for a -AO/NAO: https://twitter.com/antmasiello/status/663831265540444160
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Read HM's new tweet and retweet. There is a very strong stratospheric polar vortex right now that is forecast to get even stronger. That definitely does not bode well for a -AO/NAO: https://twitter.com/antmasiello/status/663831265540444160

And Sam Lillo said it's climo for that to happen. So???

 

https://twitter.com/splillo/status/663857272125190144

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You can't find an indicator in favor of a positive AO/NAO, aside from the el nino intensity.

Only indicator for a +AO is the +QBO/low solar is the worst combo for a SSW. But, yeah, Nino/SCE/SAI/low sea ice is all favorable for winter time AO...will be interesting to see what wins. If we don't see some solid strat warmings by early Dec it might make for a long winter. Cohen sounds real bullish on his blog today, FWIW.

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Only indicator for a +AO is the +QBO/low solar is the worst combo for a SSW. But, yeah, Nino/SCE/SAI/low sea ice is all favorable for winter time AO...will be interesting to see what wins. If we don't see some solid strat warmings by early Dec it might make for a long winter. Cohen sounds real bullish on his blog today, FWIW.

Good. At least there's something concrete on which he can be graded.
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Read HM's new tweet and retweet. There is a very strong stratospheric polar vortex right now that is forecast to get even stronger. That definitely does not bode well for a -AO/NAO: https://twitter.com/antmasiello/status/663831265540444160

One has to be cautious about extending the present into the future. Two weeks down the road, the ensembles are split on whether the AO will go negative or stay positive. The ensembles are in strong agreement that the AO will descend from current levels.

 

Historically, November 1978 featured a record AO+. The AO was above +3 on November 22. On November 25, it had fallen to -1.212. A day later, it was -2.138. From that point through mid-December, there were short-lived blocks. On December 19, 1978, a prolonged period of blocking set in.

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Only indicator for a +AO is the +QBO/low solar is the worst combo for a SSW. But, yeah, Nino/SCE/SAI/low sea ice is all favorable for winter time AO...will be interesting to see what wins. If we don't see some solid strat warmings by early Dec it might make for a long winter. Cohen sounds real bullish on his blog today, FWIW.

 

Well, no sign of a -AO for probably the first half of Dec in the Weeklies today, eh? Good thing most everyone was predicting a pretty meh Dec. 

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Only indicator for a +AO is the +QBO/low solar is the worst combo for a SSW. But, yeah, Nino/SCE/SAI/low sea ice is all favorable for winter time AO...will be interesting to see what wins. If we don't see some solid strat warmings by early Dec it might make for a long winter. Cohen sounds real bullish on his blog today, FWIW.

Yes, true.....thanks for reminding me.

I am very iffy on QBO, though....we know so little about it.

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