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The Official 2014 Fall Discussion Thread


jburns

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This is the same GFS as last year, so remember

 

  • Exact precip amounts are going to be suspect
  • The storm track could be pretty far off from what is shown
  • The storm could even disappear and reappear for a few days
  • The storm may just be suppressed by a lot of cold air

A lot hinges on what happens in Alaska, how far south the cold will make it, and what moisture, if any will fall where.

 

The most likely scenario at this time, in my opinion:

  • It'll be a little colder than last weekend
  • Mountains will still get snow regardless, but not as much
  • Rain in the valleys, maybe a few flakes mixed in
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Doc? Mack, you don't want to know. I'm not all in for Superjames or anyone. :(

 

Edit: let's see about a CAD afterward, however...never mind. :(

 

Remember there's still a lot more winter to go....well, actually all of winter to go for that matter. :)

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Doc? Mack, you don't want to know. I'm not all in for Superjames or anyone. :(

Edit: let's see about a CAD afterward, however...never mind. :(

Remember there's still a lot more winter to go....well, actually all of winter to go for that matter. :)

That's actually good news ! I don't want to miss the dd2 gtg because of snow or ice
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Just glancing at the 6z GFS it looks like a major ice storm for northern NC (particularly RDU). I don't have surface temps / dew points but this looks like it could be big. 850s stay right along the NC/Vir boarder and even slowly push southward (not away like many other situations). There is a good amount of precip with the heaviest amounts across north central NC. Still far out and this will definitely look different with next model runs; but the players are on the field.

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Looking at overnight models it seems the GFS was an anomaly. Euro has nothing really outside of rain ahead of the cold front and the GFS beta keeps everything dry as well. That being said it's too early to work out the details. I have a hard time buying  with such a sustained cold and with the battle lines of the really cold air setting up around NC/SC that you don't see an impulse ride up along that line. I'll be more interested to see what the models have to say come Monday and Tuesday. 

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Looking at overnight models it seems the GFS was an anomaly. Euro has nothing really outside of rain ahead of the cold front and the GFS beta keeps everything dry as well. That being said it's too early to work out the details. I have a hard time buying  with such a sustained cold and with the battle lines of the really cold air setting up around NC/SC that you don't see an impulse ride up along that line. I'll be more interested to see what the models have to say come Monday and Tuesday. 

Agreed. We need to get a little closer to the possible event to let the models at least depict the general setup.

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Superjames

You're talking about November snow. My mother-in-law always talks about the snow the area had on the ground the day my wife was born. Let's see if it is true. Check out Nov 16th, 1952 or thereabouts for the triad area of North Carolina.

Here's the file but you need a browser plugin: http://docs.lib.noaa.gov/rescue/dwm/1952/19521116.djvu

 

The plugin is on this page as well as the screens to allow you to pick the day you want to look at .The link above is the 16th. No snow in NC I don't think, at least not on that day. :-) I didn't check any other days, but it is fun to poke around on known good days to see what the actual map looked like. 1968 and up have additional maps and charts.

 

http://www.lib.noaa.gov/collections/imgdocmaps/daily_weather_maps.html

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Looks like a model war is ongoing , GFS vs Euro, they are totally different

 

New GFS (beta) lines up pretty well with the Euro....so I think the old GFS is out to lunch as usual....but again I'll hold out until next week. All are in agreement of cold air coming into much of the CONUS and that's the first step. 

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The EURO ENS is pretty close to the old GFS. Not a lot of difference between them at all. I think the main thing to note is the models line up on top of each other as far as the HP. It's pretty much a given it will be in place. The main differences are in the timing or if there will be an impulse riding up the SE side of the Arctic airmass.

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Just took a look at the 10 day forecast from Weatherbug on my phone. Has an 80% chance of frozen mix for the 14th, a 40% chance for the 15th, and a 50% chance for the 16th. Maybe it won't happen, but it sure is fun having something to track already and seeing the potential there.

 

The bolded is how you know to throw that program out.  No decent met would put an 80% chance of any precipitation a week out, much less for a wintry mix for Raleigh in November.

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It's hard to get excited about model watching in Mid-November.  I think in 4 weeks and should be cooking with something that would be a more reasonable possibility.  That said I've seen some mets thinking we flip back to a warmer pattern around Thanksgiving.

 

It always flips. The results for a winter is simply based on the timing of the flips, and percentage of time spent in each. 

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It's hard to get excited about model watching in Mid-November.  I think in 4 weeks and should be cooking with something that would be a more reasonable possibility.  That said I've seen some mets thinking we flip back to a warmer pattern around Thanksgiving.

 

I think it's pretty exciting having something to watch already.

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It's hard to get excited about model watching in Mid-November.  I think in 4 weeks and should be cooking with something that would be a more reasonable possibility.  That said I've seen some mets thinking we flip back to a warmer pattern around Thanksgiving.

It's very reasonable to think we will flip to a warmer pattern around the start of the year. The question then is how long do we stay. Many think the pattern will "tend" to favor the colder side of the flips through the winter. That means longer cold spells and shorter warm ones. Maybe the next cold flip will then occur right before Christmas (which would be about the right timing).

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