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The Big One - Forecast & Discussion


Wow

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Yeah guys.  I was just wondering what the RPM model (local WSI one) was doing since it seems it has been trying to save KCAE for a couple days now possibly with colder temps aloft.  Thanks for your responses!

 

Edit.  If someone from the Midlands could call into the radio show tonight (I hope you call Robert btw!) please do so.

 

I would call; but DT is still sour towards me currently.. lol

 

 

For anyone interested in using the bufkit application, you can download it from here: http://www.wdtb.noaa.gov/tools/bufkit/

 

At first; it is a bit annoying to set up if you're new.  They have instructional videos for it etc.

 

lol whoops I thought you said RGEM 

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For anyone interested in using the bufkit application, you can download it from here: http://www.wdtb.noaa.gov/tools/bufkit/

 

At first; it is a bit annoying to set up if you're new.  They have instructional videos for it etc.

 

You can actually input direct URLS into the "bufget" application part of it to download new model data without having to manually get it all the time.

 

Thanks for the link.

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I think he's pretty much alone on this one.  We shall see.

 

This really isn't that bad of a forecast. He is taking a few things into account. One models typically over perform on QPF vs. reality. Second as has been discussed ratios may not be 10:1 given how 850's are not really that cold. Then you factor in melting on the ground (though I think this is usually over analyzed) and you end up with MBY being in 3-6. Fine, if you bust and CLT gets 8 it's not a huge bust. 4 inches of snow shut down the city so it isn't like he is calling for a dusting. Impact will still be high, he stays safe with his call and everyone wins. 

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http://i.imgur.com/8RERzJK.png

 

Here's the latest NAM/GFS avg on the meteogram for us on the ZR.

 

And we may clock in at 1.7 inches... but KCAE comes in at an even worse 1.9, with even higher predicted wind speeds on the tail end of the heaviest accumulation.

 

Looks like a perfect storm.

Hi neighbor, i am ready as I can be, thanks to everyone here I started getting ready on Saturday. Again thanks everyone!

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Copy the link from the url bar at the top of your browser when you click on the data you want.  Within the bufkit program if you click the tab in the right hand corner that says get data a black box will pop up.  Middle of the way down you will see the alphabet.  Just click on D which is blank, put your cursor in the box, and click the paste button at the top.  Then click on the "get data" button.  It should show up under your airport code when you refresh.  Hope that helps!

I appreciate the help...for whatever reason its not working...   :(  TY tho!

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Cman!  I like your map, and ordinarily I'd go with it, because of all the liquid totals being toss around...you never get that much moisture to freeze... I'm just not that lucky.... but if this is a good cad,  I mean a good cad, it could blow by you and be off waving before you can get turned around good, lol.  And anyway those folks down there will string you up in effigy if you don't throw them a bone :)  Best put in a chance of zr/ip for safety's sake, lol.

  I'm going with .3 in rain, .5 in zr, .5/7 in ip/ and if the comma finds me at the end, .5/.7 in snow, lol.  And if mine doesn't work out, I'll go with yours, lol.  T

Oh, no worries! I'm mentioning the possibility of some freezing rain in the forecast. We're right on the line with this event, even if we are 3-5 degrees cooler than forecast. It'll be close for many people in my viewing area... The quick swing of snow could be nice Thursday morning, but we'll see if it actually makes it this far south. All I know is that I'll be watching that thermometer very carefully Wednesday. :lol: 

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Oh, no worries! I'm mentioning the possibility of some freezing rain in the forecast. We're right on the line with this event, even if we are 3-5 degrees cooler than forecast. It'll be close for many people in my viewing area... The quick swing of snow could be nice Thursday morning, but we'll see if it actually makes it this far south. All I know is that I'll be watching that thermometer very carefully Wednesday. :lol:

Ok, good.  I like you and don't want to see you covered in sticky feathers, lol.  Yep, this one is a fun one.  And all riding on a cad that won't set up for a while.  Did you use to have this much fun in Fla?  T

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I just took a look at the Euro ensemble mean and it's definitely a tad east of the op, but not by much. The low still veers inland a bit. The control run was really amped up and further west than the op.

With that being said, the Euro is the NW outlier at this point, so it is probably logical to conclude that the expected storm track is east of the Euro, perhaps tracking up through the Pamlico Sound or somewhere around there. We'll see. Small differences in the track will mean a lot with this one. I'm still paranoid about the pingers, though.

I actually disagree with this. The Euro ensemble means had SLP near that of the control and op runs. All inland slightly from the coast.

Secondly, it's not an outlier. The CMC has a very similar track and climatology favors the Euro track more than the eastward runs of the NAM and GFS. Thirdly, the NAM is darn near useless beyond 24 hours, so it doesn't pay to even look at it for this Wed/Thurs. Fourth, the Euro and 90% of it's ensemble members align with the op run. Consistency! Hard to bet against that.

With tonight's runs, I would like to see two things:

1. NAM trends slightly more west, not much, but enough, to begin it's alignment with the CMC and Euro.

2. The GFS should start picking up on the QPF since the jet dynamics are there along with excellent DPVA and frontogenetical forcing. A lot of dynamics. Moisture will find a way.

Just some thoughts before the models come out.

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lol whoops I thought you said RGEM 

 

My guess is you are going to have some mixing issues in CLT proper burger, I would not be surpised to see 6" of SN there through Wednesday night before it starts mixing with IP.  Question is how much QPF gets eaten by plates, which is ultimately dependent on the slp track, and ability for heights to crash on the backside.  The cold core conveyer will likely setup just to your wnw, Marion to Mt. Airy, that area will stay all SN, solidly inside the 1300m 1000-850mb thick line, flirting but right around the inflection point of 1540m 850-700mb thick.  Even if you do mix or change over to IP dominant type for 4-6hrs, this will end as SN for you, 6" front end, 1" IP, ? SN on the backside, maybe another 4-6".

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My guess is you are going to have some mixing issues in CLT proper burger, I would not be surpised to see 6" of SN there through Wednesday night before it starts mixing with IP.  Question is how much QPF gets eaten by plates, which is ultimately dependent on the slp track, and ability for heights to crash on the backside.  The cold core conveyer will likely setup just to your wnw, Marion to Mt. Airy, that area will stay all SN, solidly inside the 1300m 1000-850mb thick line, flirting but right around the inflection point of 1540m 850-700mb thick.  Even if you do mix or change over to IP dominant type for 4-6hrs, this will end as SN for you, 6" front end, 1" IP, ? SN on the backside, maybe another 4-6".

 

Thanks, I've been on the wrong side of that sleet but I like that we get the front end then back end (that's what she said?) on this one. I can do with a snow sleet sandwich. I think getting close to that 8 inch mark is a safe bet that GSP is hedging. 

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Quick question as I am sitting here in Columbia for training. I was in the middle of my AIT(Army job training) in January 2004 in Augusta when I experienced the worst ice storm of my life! Trees and power lines down all over Ft Gordon. Is the setup that occured then what we are looking at now with this storm? I remember a lot of mets talking about a cold wedge that came in from the east much like this storm.

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I actually disagree with this. The Euro ensemble means had SLP near that of the control and op runs. All inland slightly from the coast.

Secondly, it's not an outlier. The CMC has a very similar track and climatology favors the Euro track more than the eastward runs of the NAM and GFS. Thirdly, the NAM is darn near useless beyond 24 hours, so it doesn't pay to even look at it for this Wed/Thurs. Fourth, the Euro and 90% of it's ensemble members align with the op run. Consistency! Hard to bet against that.

With tonight's runs, I would like to see two things:

1. NAM trends slightly more west, not much, but enough, to begin it's alignment with the CMC and Euro.

2. The GFS should start picking up on the QPF since the jet dynamics are there along with excellent DPVA and frontogenetical forcing. A lot of dynamics. Moisture will find a way.

Just some thoughts before the models come out.

 

I think a track right along the coast or just off shore is actually probably more favored with the substantial CAD wedge in place. The high is retreating, but the fact that diabatic processes are going to occur while it is in a classical stage and then evolve to more of a hybrid would certainly argue against a coastal plain track in my opinion. I dont think slides way off shore, but I do think the operational ECMWF is a bit too far inland. We shall see.

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This alert was generated by the National Weather Service
EMWIN (Emergency Managers Weather Information Network)
from messages received by DaculaWeather.com EMWIN server.
NOUS42 KWNO 110130
ADMNFD

SENIOR DUTY METEOROLOGIST NWS ADMINISTRATIVE MESSAGE
NWS NCEP CENTRAL OPERATIONS COLLEGE PARK MD
0129Z TUE FEB 11 2014


THE 00Z NAM HAS STARTED ON-TIME...WITH 14 ALASKAN...32
CANADIAN...69 CONUS...1 CARIBBEAN AND 7 MEXICAN RAOB REPORTS AVBL
FOR INGEST.


00Z NAM RAOB RECAP...

71823/YAH - PURGED TEMP/RH 851-848 MB...SUPER-ADIABATIC
76654/MZL - 10142...GROUND EQUIPMENT FAILURE
76692/HYY - 10158...FLIGHT EQUIPMENT FAILURE


A REGIONAL CRITICAL WEATHER DAY...CWD...WILL BE DECLARED AT
1200Z TUE FEB 11 2014 AND EXTEND THROUGH 1800Z FRI FEB 14...FOR
POSSIBLE IMPACTS OF AN UPCOMING WINTER STORM IN THE SOUTH AND
EAST.


OREILLY/SDM/NCO/NCEP

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I actually disagree with this. The Euro ensemble means had SLP near that of the control and op runs. All inland slightly from the coast.

Secondly, it's not an outlier. The CMC has a very similar track and climatology favors the Euro track more than the eastward runs of the NAM and GFS. Thirdly, the NAM is darn near useless beyond 24 hours, so it doesn't pay to even look at it for this Wed/Thurs. Fourth, the Euro and 90% of it's ensemble members align with the op run. Consistency! Hard to bet against that.

With tonight's runs, I would like to see two things:

1. NAM trends slightly more west, not much, but enough, to begin it's alignment with the CMC and Euro.

2. The GFS should start picking up on the QPF since the jet dynamics are there along with excellent DPVA and frontogenetical forcing. A lot of dynamics. Moisture will find a way.

Just some thoughts before the models come out.

fwiw jb agrees with your thinking. He thinks the euro will trend farther west like the control. By the way the control hits us with almost 1.5 qpf!
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SREF looks wetter to me. Bet you the snowfall mean is off the charts for CLT west. Take that back not quite as wet. Didn't have that comma head like the SREF 15z had. 

 

A tad colder and wetter.. I figure this is from the outlier drier members dropping away as we head toward a consensus here.

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I think a track right along the coast or just off shore is actually probably more favored with the substantial CAD wedge in place. The high is retreating, but the fact that diabatic processes are going to occur while it is in a classical stage and then evolve to more of a hybrid would certainly argue against a coastal plain track in my opinion. I dont think slides way off shore, but I do think the operational ECMWF is a bit too far inland. We shall see.

Agreed with this.  I would argue for a more offshore track, in fact, an energy transfer could happen given the expected strength of the wedge, and the fact the baroclinic zone is expected to set up offshore sometime late tonight into tomorrow sets the stage for that to occur.  really really difficult to scour out a classic wedge even this far south, especially with expected N to NNE winds 15-20 gusts to 30 mph at times, and the continuous precipitation should proclude any real SFC warming with such a fetch from that arctic high expected to be 1035'ish or greater. 

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Agreed with this.  I would argue for a more offshore track, in fact, an energy transfer could happen given the expected strength of the wedge, and the fact the baroclinic zone is expected to set up offshore sometime late tonight into tomorrow sets the stage for that to occur.  really really difficult to scour out a classic wedge even this far south, especially with expected N to NNE winds 15-20 gusts to 30 mph at times, and the continuous precipitation should proclude any real SFC warming with such a fetch from that arctic high expected to be 1035'ish or greater. 

Stormsfury, you nailed the icestorm in 2004.  Are you thinking this is similar for the midlands?  

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