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January 2016 Pattern Disco


Damage In Tolland

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This thread is starting to sound a bit like the NYC thread.  Let's step back for a minute and remember a few things:

  • normal and slightly above normal in January is nice winter weather
  • we are in a stepping down process and yesterday was a part of that
  • this isn't last february and it won't be unceasingly cold and snowy
  • we usually don't want full on arctic blasts because they are suppressive and good for the MA
  • we are not the MA and normal to slightly above is not a torch
  • the pattern change which is happening looks to bring a +PNA, which usually works out well for us
  • this pattern change is making more cold air and even potentially some blocking available to us
  • there is a southern stream this year, and a split flow
  •  

 

Just pretend it is early-mid December and we are stepping down, because that is what this feels like to me.  The hyperbole is ridiculous and unwarranted...torches, pull the blinds, etc.  Also, January 15???  I guess that is possible but there has been a storm signal near the 10th for a while now.

 

Perhaps my attitude is affected by the 6.5 inches at my stake and the flakes wafting down as I write.

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I don't see anything big through the next 10 days. Can't rule out a small clipper type system though.

Pattern looks nice after that. The big question is how long does that pattern last? Is it the dominant pattern for the remainder of the winter or does it break down again fairly quickly?

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GFS barfed all over itself in the event we had yesterday, I'm skeptical of what it is showing

It didn't totally barf.  It barfed in it representation of the temperature profiles but remember, it was the faster option all along, while the Euro was starting precip Tuesday afternoon for a number of runs.  Also,didn't the GFS better represent the position of the high in the medium range where the Euro had it sliding off east faster?  The Euro moved towards the GFS in this regard.  My takeaway is that we shouldn't trust GFS temp profiles; instead we should blend the other guidance.  But for overall synoptic set-up didn't the GFS do decently, particularly 3-6 days out?

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So you don't agree with any of my points, for example the Euro being too slow, and not right with the high? I'm talking a mid range 3-7 days out.

It was better then, but what's the usefulness of that? When it comes time to make critical decisions, that's when I need a model to work for me. It failed and failed big in that regard.
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So you don't agree with any of my points, for example the Euro being too slow, and not right with the high?  I'm talking a mid range 3-7 days out.

Euro was a little slower at one point in the mid range, but IIRC it wasn't significantly faster than the other models 3-4 days out. Plus it's a SWFE...they always seem to come in faster than guidance.

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Well mid range is very useful to a weenie; it is like meth.

But you actually get paid to forecast so I get your point.

 

Yesterday was a beautiful reason why humans can be so useful to augment models. The srfc temp forecasts were pretty bad and any automation that was GFS based probably failed.

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You did more than voice a concern. You do realize it isn't even January yet and Scott is speculating about something that might happen a month from now?

Of course. There's reasons to worry . IO forcing, ridge in NW Canada collapsing, even suppression. Nothing should make anyone feel confident one way or the other.
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Of course. There's reasons to worry . IO forcing, ridge in NW Canada collapsing, even suppression. Nothing should make anyone feel confident one way or the other.

Anything can happen of course, and nothing in certain.

 

The consistent signal in the ensembles across all of the global models, the shift of the CFS...these things don't make you, or shouldn't make anyone more confident than 50-50?  I actually don't understand you at all here.  We should all be a bit more than average confidence that we are going to have a colder, snowier period for at least 2-3 of the next 4 weeks.

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Anything can happen of course, and nothing in certain.

 

The consistent signal in the ensembles across all of the global models, the shift of the CFS...these things don't make you, or shouldn't make anyone more confident than 50-50?  I actually don't understand you at all here.  We should all be a bit more than average confidence that we are going to have a colder, snowier period for at least 2-3 of the next 4 weeks.

Maybe 2 at the most. The next 2 weeks will likely average aoa with little snow. The next one is probably cold and snowy while beyond we just don't know. Many things point to a sustained nice pattern but there are flags which need to be acknowledged. We're in the strongest Nino in history and it isn't fading quickly yet.

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I (and others) think mid to late Jan look decent for normal cold and a chance at a few storms if they don't stay south. The danger seems to be pattern breaking mild late late month and Feb. I don't buy sustained winter in Feb at all. It may well happen, but there's enough reasons to not feel confident about that to walk very softly

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It didn't totally barf.  It barfed in it representation of the temperature profiles but remember, it was the faster option all along, while the Euro was starting precip Tuesday afternoon for a number of runs.  Also,didn't the GFS better represent the position of the high in the medium range where the Euro had it sliding off east faster?  The Euro moved towards the GFS in this regard.  My takeaway is that we shouldn't trust GFS temp profiles; instead we should blend the other guidance.  But for overall synoptic set-up didn't the GFS do decently, particularly 3-6 days out?

 

Yeah that's what I was thinking.  It was awful with the mid-level warmth but the overall synoptics of that last system it pretty much remained steady from Day 5-6 all the way up to go time with the exception of like one or two further south runs. 

 

I wouldn't not use the GFS because it botched the H75 warm layer yesterday.  It wasn't like its synoptics were completely off.

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Of course. There's reasons to worry . IO forcing, ridge in NW Canada collapsing, even suppression. Nothing should make anyone feel confident one way or the other.

 

Well if you're worried about a warmer pattern (such as the western ridge collapsing), and then yet worried also about suppression, you've covered all the basis.  Worrying about mixed precip warm storms, and also worrying about suppression, seems like mixed signals.

 

But like I've been saying, if the pattern flips and brings a couple big mid-Atlantic events without much fan fare in New England, then folks are going to really melt down.

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Yeah that's what I was thinking.  It was awful with the mid-level warmth but the overall synoptics of that last system it pretty much remained steady from Day 5-6 all the way up to go time with the exception of like one or two further south runs. 

 

I wouldn't not use the GFS because it botched the H75 warm layer yesterday.  It wasn't like its synoptics were completely off.

 

Which makes it even worse. It blew on thermal profiles, 6 hrs out. It was pretty bad. It's one of the most important models,and you had to completely toss it.

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Yesterday was a beautiful reason why humans can be so useful to augment models. The srfc temp forecasts were pretty bad and any automation that was GFS based probably failed.

 

And many noted this portion time and time again, That the models all seem to struggle with the shallow cold at the surface and are to fast to erode it out, The biggest factor was in the mid levels, GFS handled this portion poorly, And as Will mentioned, These SWFE always tend to come in faster which in turn when there is sleet involved, That seems to as well, I think the RGEM handled this fairly well as well as the Euro

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