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Possible 3/20-3/21 Coastal Storm


Zelocita Weather

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GFS, 60+ Hr NAM.... vs euro, ukie, eps, 80% of ensemble support, JMA, and partially the GGEM....

Not even a contest. The crazy ensemble support is the biggest tell all IMO. At this stage I am much more worried about this storm hugging the coast to tightly and dry slotting and causing warmer surface temps for I-95 and east. I doubt this thing goes out to sea with this setup and these water temps. I think areas 50-100 miles nw of I-95 jackpot, along with the higher elevations.

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With the ensemble means of the ECM showing what they are and they being the better ensemble package and with a major lean west the ECM is more likely to come in further west tonight...

 

Timing: GFS is a progressive model compared to the ECM...so until we get closer its going to have its issues. One issue i see is height raises do not occur on the GFS like they do on the ECM and there is your most likely difference and reason why its having problems.. Look at the NAVGEM this is suppose to be the most progressive model...then look at the GFS.. 

 

Euro is not alone here ....it has back up and support and it does not look like WPC is buying the GFS either..

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Mt Holly NWS discussion.

No talk of a huge snow storm, but rather a small event.

 

LONG TERM /FRIDAY NIGHT THROUGH THURSDAY/...
THE MAIN CONCERN WITH THE LONG TERM FORECAST IS THE COASTAL STORM
EXPECTED THIS WEEKEND. THERE IS CONSIDERABLE UNCERTAINTY WITH THE
TIMING OF THE STORM WITH SEVERAL SOLUTIONS
. THE GFS IS THE
FASTEST, WHILE THE ECMWF IS THE SLOWEST. THE NAM AND CANADIAN ARE
GENERALLY IN BETWEEN THE OTHER TWO. THE GFS IS INDICATING THE
PRECIPITATION COULD BEGIN AS EARLY AS SATURDAY AFTERNOON, WHILE
THE ECMWF DOESN`T BRING MUCH IN UNTIL AFTER MIDNIGHT. THE CANADIAN
AND NAM GENERALLY BRING PRECIPITATION IN DURING THE
EVENING/OVERNIGHT. SO FOR NOW, WE`VE INCREASE POPS SATURDAY NIGHT,
WITH HIGHEST PROBABILITIES ACROSS THE SOUTH. SUNDAY HAS THE
HIGHEST POPS EVERYWHERE AS THIS WILL THE MOST LIKELY PERIOD FOR
PRECIPITATION BASED ON CONSENSUS WITH ALL OF THE GUIDANCE. AS WE
PROGRESS INTO SUNDAY NIGHT, THE ECMWF IS THE SLOWEST CLEARING THE
PRECIPITATION, ALTHOUGH ALL GUIDANCE DOES INDICATE SOME POTENTIAL
FOR AT LEAST THE EVENING HOURS, SO WE`LL SLOWLY LOWER POPS THROUGH
THE NIGHT SUNDAY.

THE NEXT QUESTION BECOMES WHAT THE P-TYPES WILL BE. AS ALWAYS,
BUT EVEN MORE SO IN THIS TRANSITION PERIOD BETWEEN SEASONS, THE
THERMAL PROFILE WILL HAVE A SIGNIFICANT EFFECT ON WHERE
PRECIPITATION FALLS AS SNOW OR RAIN, OR A WINTRY MIX OF
RAIN/SLEET/SNOW. PRETTY MUCH ALL GUIDANCE INDICATES AREAS
BASICALLY RIGHT ALONG, AND NORTH AND WEST OF THE I-95 CORRIDOR
WILL LIKELY REMAIN ALL SNOW DURING THE ENTIRE EVENT. HOWEVER, WITH
WARM GROUND AND MARGINAL TEMPERATURES, SNOW AMOUNTS COULD POSSIBLY
LIMITED. THIS DOES NOT MEAN WE WON`T GET AN ACCUMULATION. AREAS
SOUTH OF THE I-95 CORRIDOR COULD BEGIN AS SNOW, THEN MIX WITH OR
CHANGE OVER TO RAIN AT TIMES, THEN POSSIBLY CHANGE BACK TO SNOW
BEFORE IT ENDS. FOR AREAS WHERE THE PRECIPITATION REMAINS ALL
SNOW, WE COULD SEE AT LEAST 2-4 INCHES OF SNOW, WHILE AREAS THAT
CHANGE OVER TO RAIN MAY NOT SEE MUCH AT ALL. AREAS IN BETWEEN
COULD SEE MAYBE 1-2 INCHES, WITH LESS FOR THOSE WHO MIX. AS

USUAL, THIS WILL LIKELY CHANGE OVER THE NEXT FEW FORECAST CYCLES,
SO CONTINUE TO MONITOR THE FORECAST FOR FUTURE UPDATES.

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Mt Holly NWS discussion.

No talk of a huge snow storm, but rather a small event.

 

LONG TERM /FRIDAY NIGHT THROUGH THURSDAY/...

THE MAIN CONCERN WITH THE LONG TERM FORECAST IS THE COASTAL STORM

EXPECTED THIS WEEKEND. THERE IS CONSIDERABLE UNCERTAINTY WITH THE

TIMING OF THE STORM WITH SEVERAL SOLUTIONS. THE GFS IS THE

FASTEST, WHILE THE ECMWF IS THE SLOWEST. THE NAM AND CANADIAN ARE

GENERALLY IN BETWEEN THE OTHER TWO. THE GFS IS INDICATING THE

PRECIPITATION COULD BEGIN AS EARLY AS SATURDAY AFTERNOON, WHILE

THE ECMWF DOESN`T BRING MUCH IN UNTIL AFTER MIDNIGHT. THE CANADIAN

AND NAM GENERALLY BRING PRECIPITATION IN DURING THE

EVENING/OVERNIGHT. SO FOR NOW, WE`VE INCREASE POPS SATURDAY NIGHT,

WITH HIGHEST PROBABILITIES ACROSS THE SOUTH. SUNDAY HAS THE

HIGHEST POPS EVERYWHERE AS THIS WILL THE MOST LIKELY PERIOD FOR

PRECIPITATION BASED ON CONSENSUS WITH ALL OF THE GUIDANCE. AS WE

PROGRESS INTO SUNDAY NIGHT, THE ECMWF IS THE SLOWEST CLEARING THE

PRECIPITATION, ALTHOUGH ALL GUIDANCE DOES INDICATE SOME POTENTIAL

FOR AT LEAST THE EVENING HOURS, SO WE`LL SLOWLY LOWER POPS THROUGH

THE NIGHT SUNDAY.

THE NEXT QUESTION BECOMES WHAT THE P-TYPES WILL BE. AS ALWAYS,

BUT EVEN MORE SO IN THIS TRANSITION PERIOD BETWEEN SEASONS, THE

THERMAL PROFILE WILL HAVE A SIGNIFICANT EFFECT ON WHERE

PRECIPITATION FALLS AS SNOW OR RAIN, OR A WINTRY MIX OF

RAIN/SLEET/SNOW. PRETTY MUCH ALL GUIDANCE INDICATES AREAS

BASICALLY RIGHT ALONG, AND NORTH AND WEST OF THE I-95 CORRIDOR

WILL LIKELY REMAIN ALL SNOW DURING THE ENTIRE EVENT. HOWEVER, WITH

WARM GROUND AND MARGINAL TEMPERATURES, SNOW AMOUNTS COULD POSSIBLY

LIMITED. THIS DOES NOT MEAN WE WON`T GET AN ACCUMULATION. AREAS

SOUTH OF THE I-95 CORRIDOR COULD BEGIN AS SNOW, THEN MIX WITH OR

CHANGE OVER TO RAIN AT TIMES, THEN POSSIBLY CHANGE BACK TO SNOW

BEFORE IT ENDS. FOR AREAS WHERE THE PRECIPITATION REMAINS ALL

SNOW, WE COULD SEE AT LEAST 2-4 INCHES OF SNOW, WHILE AREAS THAT

CHANGE OVER TO RAIN MAY NOT SEE MUCH AT ALL. AREAS IN BETWEEN

COULD SEE MAYBE 1-2 INCHES, WITH LESS FOR THOSE WHO MIX. AS

USUAL, THIS WILL LIKELY CHANGE OVER THE NEXT FEW FORECAST CYCLES,

SO CONTINUE TO MONITOR THE FORECAST FOR FUTURE UPDATES.

 

There not going to at this point and time say anything different with the spread in models..And even with no spread they would not say anything different. MT Holly NWS with this years blizzard of 31.9 inches at ABE started their forecast for 4-8 inches ..well the final was 31.9 so there conservative stance chose to bite them hard...

 

Sit back, watch, and wait for the agreement on the models... 

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this isn't accurate. According to euro this is a coastal snowstorm, leaving NYC with high winds and heavy wet snow. U may be talking about twin forks that could have an inch or two as the storm pulls out

Edit: this is a big storm, NYC will cash in cause it's a bit closer to the storm resulting bigger accumulated precipitation but lower ratios, ulster and north jersey will have less accumulated precipitation but colder and lower wind speeds resulting much higher ratios, still a general 12-24 inches is possible except for extreme Long Island. Unless this storm trends west which I doubt!

Please stop. Show me a map that shows anyone getting 24" snow let alone NYC and the middle of the Island getting that. I think there is more of a concern for all of Long Island including the city to experience more rain than snow and perhaps the dreaded dry slot. Exaggerated totals do nobody any good at this point.

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There not going to at this point and time say anything different with the spread in models..And even with no spread they would not say anything different. MT Holly NWS with this years blizzard of 31.9 inches at ABE started their forecast for 4-8 inches ..well the final was 31.9 so there conservative stance chose to bite them hard...

 

Sit back, watch, and wait for the agreement on the models... 

 

Not so sure.Euro has been a train wreck this year again.

Toss is the Canada & UK for a coastal.

GFS & NAM are showing minor events and have done well this year.

I would have expected the NAM to be tossing cigars to fans at this point.

 

The new MAM model is another story.

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Not so sure.Euro has been a train wreck this year again.

Toss is the Canada & UK for a coastal.

GFS & NAM are showing minor events and have done well this year.

I would have expected the NAM to be tossing cigars to fans at this point.

 

The new MAM model is another story.

The Euro and UK have verified best this year.  If you think the GFS is a better indication than the Euro ensembles i dont know what to tell you.

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People need to stop getting carried away. 3 days gives a lot of time for changes. The smart thing for any forecaster to do right now would be to say a few inches is likely with the possibility for more if models like the Euro are right. If it really does end up like the GFS or NAM, not many would see much accumulation anyway, due to marginal temps and the warm ground. And in late March, the sun angle does make a difference when the snow is light. 

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Not so sure.Euro has been a train wreck this year again.

Toss is the Canada & UK for a coastal.

GFS & NAM are showing minor events and have done well this year.

I would have expected the NAM to be tossing cigars to fans at this point.

 

The new MAM model is another story.

European model was the model that allowed me to tell my clients days in advance that we were getting what we were getting and then the NAM model sealed the deal... i will agree to disagree about the NAM/GFS cause just cause the NAM gets one storm right does not make it reliable and the GFS is hardly ever correct.... 

Wait till the models come into agreement ..You can tell looking at the GFS ensemble mean and spread from 12 Z why the operational is the way it is ...it has the lows spread OUT ALL OVER the place...so different solution on that model each time until it gets its act together and picks up on the higher heights.. NAM may have a clue in 24-48 hrs prior...

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Well, if the Euro blows this one after being relatively consistent for several runs showing an I95 special, then perhaps the new and improved Euro needs some, um, more improvements. Fingers crossed it is leading the way like the days of old when it was referred to as "The King".

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk

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If anything, the new hi res when running in parallel was too far east with our snowstorms this winter compared

to the old. That may be why the EPS has been consistently west of the OP with this storm. I can remember

the new Euro only had 8" for me here in SW Suffolk a day before the blizzard and the old OP 15".

The Parallel Euro definitely seemed to have a progressive bias

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Question for those in the NYC/NJ area. Is there any stations throwing out numbers yet for the storm?

Just curious, the only numbers I've seen have been from TWC. They had a map out since this am and totals have been in their text products since Monday.

Not that I've seen. Lee Goldberg said he'll do predictions at 11:00 P.M., Lonnie probably will too.

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