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1 minute ago, SouthCoastMA said:

My wife is a teacher and she has been physically at the school since last September. Has there really been situations where kids are at the school and the teachers aren't? 

Yep.

I can't speak to MA schools, just local MD schools.

That said, even if the teachers get vaccinated and return, it hardly matters because many kids are still remote, and it isn't "fair" to teach the in-person kids differently from the remote kids, so everyone gets the remote package (some are just sitting in a school building instead of on their couch). Maybe it is different in MA, not sure. 

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1 hour ago, tamarack said:

Fortunately I stepped away from recreational alcohol years ago.  However, the day after Moderna #2 I became surprisingly fatigued while gardening and pruning the apple trees.  Following day, a long and active Easter Sunday, no fatigue beyond the expected.  I probably (and thankfully) had it easier than many.

Only drink professionally now? :P

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1 hour ago, dryslot said:

I must of missed the don't drink part after my shot, I had plenty of water but it was mixed with something else.

I’ve been using alcohol to ward off illnesses for years. It seems to have worked.

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You can kinda "choose" which shot you want. 

For example, if you want Pfizier and have your heart set on Pfizier...then work on getting an appointment with Walgreens b/c they only deal with the Pfizier vaccine. On the VAMS site I think it also states which vaccines each location has so you can look for one that only deals with whatever one you're interested in.

 

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Some posts over recent pages touched on this a little...

At first I tended to a smidge of <_< attitude about the logic of consignment practices myself, I mean considering the average household.

For the bell curve of population density ... the vast majority of household do not come along with state of the art ventilation systems like you get in these 750,000 $ luxurious baronial modern homes up therein N. Westford Mass...  Whatever the numbers are, but 70...80...90 % of median edifices are like the grid layout housing of the San Fernando Valley, ... Or worse yet, "the projects" of common vernacular ..etc, up through lower mid class apartment complexes ...perhaps built 20 years standards, and probably most likley do not provide ICU ventilation filtration ( obviously).  These are homes where ventilation is achieved by opening a window. Moreover, they cannot leave those vulnerabilities unattended, not for very long given to the travails of 'common socioeconomic stressing' - to put it nicely.

SO, those environments in fact "concentrate" pathogenic agents - that seems to be in paradox wrt open "distancing" physical settings. In the latter sense, one might immediately suspect spreading out, huh - that is what lowers concentration from parts per thousand toward millions ... or billions.  Considering the theoretical particle load requirement for C-19, it seems less is best.

But that's the 'surface logic' ?    'lockdown' ensured what?

Well, ...I think it all still just comes down to the original concept of needing to slow the rate transmission through an otherwise nakedly vulnerable population. We can't forget, the medical infrastructure ...and science for that matter et al, was immediately assessed as inadequate. 

I can picture the seen. The room smells of old coffee in a pall tinged by stale cologne, together not completely damping out the sterility of a typical Pentagon Nat security conference room setting.  It's closed-door session with WHO representation,

"So what you are telling me is that as bad as I think this is, it's much worse, or -" 

"I'm trying to impress that you don't know - you cannot make assumptions based on those exmples.  SAR 2003... the Flu, 1918. Irrelevant.  This is unknown vector, sir, and considering where this appears to have originated --" 

"Uh, hold on. Wait right there.  I must interrupt to remind the members of present meeting and to any party privy to or affiliated to this information, this cannot be made public - go ahead. You were saying"

"Ah...right. So early indications, this caries a very real chance to cripple society."

"OH c'mon - cripple."

"Quite please. Please... people, let her finish" 

Stronger exhale precedes, "What we are suggesting is a messy event, sir" fashioning double quotations in the air.

Chuckles reverberate.   "Excuse me - I'm sorry. Uh "Messy" ? 

"It's, ah, what we refer to as an M - S - E event ... uh, a modern setback event. Basically, it could very well bring the Industrial civilities of the world for that matter back to before --"

"Relax. Relax. I get it. Despite the incredulity of the others," panning his eyes across the retinue briefly, "You sold me at 'considering where it originated.'  

"Okay. Okay. I'm on the same page - you're talking about panic and social order."

"You have to understand," the head of Sociological Stability Research Division intercedes, " ...We are already dealing with self- propagating force in culture and society, already nearing a break-point where social trust cannot be restored, and --"

"Oh god"

They had to give medicine and science a chance to catch up.  Offering no advice given the novel nature and the early infectious rates, when mass media was only offering dour dystopian fear scenarios with images of intubation and other horrors, ...panic was also a concern - no doubt.   Break down of social order becomes a national and perhaps Global security risk..It domino dimensions.  Hind sight being 20/20 has it's advantages, but it is too easy to forget the utter conundrum of unknowns faced 18 months ago.

There was also going to have to be an assumption of 'process of discovery' built into this. I mean, the hint there was in the term, 'NOVEL' when this was first described.   Novel SAR-CoV-2 virus ...etc...  So to be fair.

Yeah, the poor household that succumbs ..but that is a control - sort of - environment that is thus containable ...because when quarantine is implement, containment can take place... spread in the total population is slowed and those infrastructures can keep up.

 

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18 minutes ago, weatherwiz said:

You can kinda "choose" which shot you want. 

For example, if you want Pfizier and have your heart set on Pfizier...then work on getting an appointment with Walgreens b/c they only deal with the Pfizier vaccine. On the VAMS site I think it also states which vaccines each location has so you can look for one that only deals with whatever one you're interested in.

 

Lol I just my second Moderna.....at Walgreens 

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1 hour ago, PhineasC said:

Yep.

I can't speak to MA schools, just local MD schools.

That said, even if the teachers get vaccinated and return, it hardly matters because many kids are still remote, and it isn't "fair" to teach the in-person kids differently from the remote kids, so everyone gets the remote package (some are just sitting in a school building instead of on their couch). Maybe it is different in MA, not sure. 

teachers are in classroom here-we were "hybrid" for most of the year-abruptly went back full time 3/8, about 10% chose to remain remote-they have separate teachers for that program.   Whole thing has been a mess, should have gone back full time in Sept....yeah some kids will be out on Quarantine but on any given day here 85-90% are in school (remote kids not included in that #)   Our system has already said there will be no all remote option come Sept.

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2 minutes ago, Ginx snewx said:

Lol I just my second Moderna.....at Walgreens 

hmmm that's strange. My friend is a pharmacy tech at a Walgreens and said Walgreens only is dealing with the Pfizier one. Maybe it depends on district? 

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21 minutes ago, Brian5671 said:

teachers are in classroom here-we were "hybrid" for most of the year-abruptly went back full time 3/8, about 10% chose to remain remote-they have separate teachers for that program.   Whole thing has been a mess, should have gone back full time in Sept....yeah some kids will be out on Quarantine but on any given day here 85-90% are in school (remote kids not included in that #)   Our system has already said there will be no all remote option come Sept.

It'll be interesting to see how many districts enforce a "no-remote" rule. That will cause issues with some parents (and some teachers).

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47 minutes ago, HIPPYVALLEY said:

I’ve been using alcohol to ward off illnesses for years. It seems to have worked.

You have to cultivate a bodily environment that is simply too hostile for even a virus to survive. Something akin to the Earth's mantle or perhaps the surface of an asteroid baked in solar radiation should do it. 

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6 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

It'll be interesting to see how many districts enforce a "no-remote" rule. That will cause issues with some parents (and some teachers).

it will be an issue mainly at the elementary level as 12 and up will have vaccines by Sept most likely

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Some posts over recent pages touched on this a little...
At first I tended to a smidge of <_ attitude about the logic of consignment practices myself i mean considering average household.> For the bell curve of population density ... the vast majority of household do not come along with state of the art ventilation systems like you get in these 750,000 $ luxurious baronial modern homes up therein N. Westford Mass...  Whatever the numbers are, but 70...80...90 % of median edifices are like the grid layout housing of the San Fernando Valley, ... Or worse yet, "the projects" of common vernacular ..etc, up through lower mid class apartment complexes ...perhaps built 20 years standards, and probably most likley do not provide ICU ventilation filtration ( obviously).  These are homes where ventilation is achieved by opening a window. Moreover, they cannot leave those vulnerabilities unattended, not for very long given to the travails of 'common socioeconomic stressing' - to put it nicely.
SO, those environments in fact "concentrate" pathogenic agents - that seems to be in paradox wrt open "distancing" physical settings. In the latter sense, one might immediately suspect spreading out, huh - that is what lowers concentration from parts per thousand toward millions ... or billions.  Considering the theoretical particle load requirement for C-19, it seems less is best.
But that's the 'surface logic' ?    'lockdown' ensured what?
Well, ...I think it all still just comes down to the original concept of needing to slow the rate transmission through an otherwise nakedly vulnerable population. We can't forget, the medical infrastructure ...and science for that matter et al, was immediately assessed as inadequate. 
I can picture the seen. The room smells of old coffee in a pall tinged by stale cologne, together not completely damping out the sterility of a typical Pentagon Nat security conference room setting.  It's closed-door session with WHO representation,
"So what you are telling me is that as bad as I think this is, it's much worse, or -" 
"I'm trying to impress that you don't know - you cannot make assumptions based on those exmples.  SAR 2003... the Flu, 1918. Irrelevant.  This is unknown vector, sir, and considering where this appears to have originated --" 
"Uh, hold on. Wait right there.  I must interrupt to remind the members of present meeting and to any party privy to or affiliated to this information, this cannot be made public - go ahead. You were saying"
"Ah...right. So early indications, this caries a very real chance to cripple society."
"OH c'mon - cripple."
"Quite please. Please... people, let her finish" 
Stronger exhale precedes, "What we are suggesting is a messy event, sir" fashioning double quotations in the air.
Chuckles reverberate.   "Excuse me - I'm sorry. Uh "Messy" ? 
"It's, ah, what we refer to as an M - S - E event ... uh, a modern setback event. Basically, it could very well bring the Industrial civilities of the world for that matter back to before --"
"Relax. Relax. I get it. Despite the incredulity of the others," panning his eyes across the retinue briefly, "You sold me at 'considering where it originated.'  
"Okay. Okay. I'm on the same page - you're talking about panic and social order."
"You have to understand," the head of Sociological Stability Research Division intercedes, " ...We are already dealing with self- propagating force in culture and society, already nearing a break-point where social trust cannot be restored, and --"
"Oh god"
They had to give medicine and science a chance to catch up.  Offering no advice given the novel nature and the early infectious rates, when mass media was only offering dour dystopian fear scenarios with images of intubation and other horrors, ...panic was also a concern - no doubt.   Break down of social order becomes a national and perhaps Global security risk..It domino dimensions.  Hind sight being 20/20 has it's advantages, but it is too easy to forget the utter conundrum of unknowns faced 18 months ago.
There was also going to have to be an assumption of 'process of discovery' built into this. I mean, the hint there was in the term, 'NOVEL' when this was first described.   Novel SAR-CoV-2 virus ...etc...  So to be fair.
Yeah, the poor household that succumbs ..but that is a control - sort of - environment that is thus containable ...because when quarantine is implement, containment can take place... spread in the total population is slowed and those infrastructures can keep up.
 
Cliff notes. And please tell me you don't bang that out on a phone

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

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1 minute ago, Brian5671 said:

it will be an issue mainly at the elementary level as 12 and up will have vaccines by Sept most likely

Many, many parents are not even going to get themselves vaccinated, much less vaccinate their 12-18 year old kids...

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My wife's school district banned any remote learning if you weren't in covid protocol. If you just didn't feel like going to school because you were sick (non-covid), you are absent that day and no remote learning. They just went back full time....previously was a hybrid model.

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Just now, ORH_wxman said:

My wife's school district banned any remote learning if you weren't in covid protocol. If you just didn't feel like going to school because you were sick (non-covid), you are absent that day and no remote learning.

If you are in "COVID protocol" is there a separate teacher to teach you during that time, or are you on Zoom with the rest of your class?

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Just now, PhineasC said:

If you are in "COVID protocol" is there a separate teacher to teach you during that time, or are you on Zoom with the rest of your class?

You are on zoom with the same teacher. But the reason they banned others from doing that is because they want the teachers to just be teaching the class in-person and not to have to multi-task teaching both in person and remote at the same time. Most teachers don't have any students in covid protocol at any given time.

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11 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

Many, many parents are not even going to get themselves vaccinated, much less vaccinate their 12-18 year old kids...

yeah i get that, but from the school's point of view-we're open, you have the chance to get vaccinated so if you don't that's on you.

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Just now, ORH_wxman said:

You are on zoom with the same teacher. But the reason they banned others from doing that is because they want the teachers to just be teaching the class in-person and not to have to multi-task teaching both in person and remote at the same time. Most teachers don't have any students in covid protocol at any given time.

That's good. A permanent version of what you described with some students always remote and therefore everyone on Zoom all day is what "in person" means here in MD in most schools. I think many schools are going to remain like this for a long time to come, but I could be wrong.

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1 minute ago, Brian5671 said:

yeah i get that, but from the school's point of view-we're open, you have the chance to get vaccinated so if you don't that's on you.

If you don't get vaccinated you can't go to school and therefore need to stay remote... that's exactly what I am talking about.

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26 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

Saw a stat that 80% of teachers are now vaccinated, yet many large districts refuse to return to school. This issue is bigger and more complicated than just "getting jabs in arms"...

this is just the beginning. I'm sure a lot of the remote, work-from-home folks that have been vaccinated still won't feel safe and make a case they should be able to stay home forever.

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The maine online vax sign up is log jammed. Every time I try to get a slot, the sites either crash or show an appt time, but by the time you fill out your name and such, it says appt is not avail. Wonder how many people will say f-it.

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2 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

this is just the beginning. I'm sure a lot of the remote, work-from-home folks that have been vaccinated still won't feel safe and make a case they should be able to stay home forever.

People don’t want to relinquish the work from home stuff, that’s at least part of it.

Teachers unions, especially the larger ones, continue to spin the wheel of reasons why teachers can’t go back, citing variants and all that stuff.

If you’re vaccinated and still don’t want to return to classrooms, why is that? Is it safety? Or is it teaching from home on zoom is a good gig, despite everyone trying to tell us it’s harder.

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23 minutes ago, ORH_wxman said:

My wife's school district banned any remote learning if you weren't in covid protocol. If you just didn't feel like going to school because you were sick (non-covid), you are absent that day and no remote learning. They just went back full time....previously was a hybrid model.

My mother is a teacher, and having to both teach in person and conduct separate remote learning lessons with students who are either in quarantine or staying out of school for other reasons is like having a whole second job. The amount of extra prep work she has to do is unreal. She's working I-banking analyst type hours.

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8 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

this is just the beginning. I'm sure a lot of the remote, work-from-home folks that have been vaccinated still won't feel safe and make a case they should be able to stay home forever.

The CDC and media will help them make that case by talking about "double mutant variants" that are vaccine-resistant and the hordes of unvaccinated people still out there. It's already in motion.

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17 minutes ago, Lava Rock said:

this is just the beginning. I'm sure a lot of the remote, work-from-home folks that have been vaccinated still won't feel safe and make a case they should be able to stay home forever.

This is true.

I personally know a few people in my division (who haven't been in one time since we got sent home in March 2020) that have said they don't feel safe back in the office even after vaccination. Mean while  my crew and I have been back in the lab since last June. 

I think some have gotten used to staying at home on zoom in their PJ's. 

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4 minutes ago, WhitinsvilleWX said:

This is true.

I personally know a few people in my division (who haven't been in one time since we got sent home in March 2020) that have said they don't feel safe back in the office even after vaccination. Mean while  my crew and I have been back in the lab since last June. 

I think some have gotten used to staying at home on zoom in their PJ's. 

I worked from home last march/apr for ~3 weeks total and went back full time. Can't run lab exps from home. :thumbsup:

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19 minutes ago, PhineasC said:

The CDC and media will help them make that case by talking about "double mutant variants" that are vaccine-resistant and the hordes of unvaccinated people still out there. It's already in motion.

Don't forget the variant articles out there saying children are in danger. Unions will love this.  Mentions more lockdowns too.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.forbes.com/sites/jonathanponciano/2021/04/04/biden-covid-official-warns-game-changing-variant-infects-kids-very-readily-and-could-spur-new-lockdowns/amp/&ved=2ahUKEwjLib2vyuzvAhUNFFkFHaVjBdUQFjAOegQIHhAC&usg=AOvVaw0I28usv8cm2t2YtYtkfImj&ampcf=1

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14 minutes ago, WhitinsvilleWX said:

This is true.

I personally know a few people in my division (who haven't been in one time since we got sent home in March 2020) that have said they don't feel safe back in the office even after vaccination. Mean while  my crew and I have been back in the lab since last June. 

I think some have gotten used to staying at home on zoom in their PJ's. 

Humans are deceptive ... in this case, 'guisers'  

They hide their desire for ease and comforts behind a guise of that concern, a film of virtuosity, purported by a fear of safety aspect - when what they are really after, but feel they need to be dishonest about ...is not having to smell bad breath in a company meeting, and listen to some other workoholic drone on about quarterly mission statements - answer to bosses they loathe in person. Or deal with other people they have to pretend are part of a corporate 'family' in general.  To mention, commuting and giving 45 - per average per capita - hours a week to interior of one's car, or public hustle and bustle of T-stops...etc...etc... in other words, they've found comfort doing their gigs as societal shut-ins and they fear losing it, so instead of being honest, ...they lie, and hide behind that nonsense... 

And the beauty of it is, since we live in a 'WOKE' era now...we are not allowed to challenge other people's 'feelings' or we're shaders -  brilliant!

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