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JAN 20th-22nd potential..


NaoPos

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6z GFS doesn't have a threat . Looks cold and dry.

I still feel something could happen in the period from 120-180 hours out as far as a relatively significant storm...the 06z GFS has something off the SE Coast and we are currently sitting in the GFS dead range of 5-7 days where it often has big problems picking these things up....the GEM has been progressive all season and the Euro has been inconsistent...we should see some consensus towards a storm in the next 48-72 hours if its going to happen.

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The GFS has been hysterically horrible with this potential so far for this storm at the end of the week. First it focused on the northern stream system with no sign of a southern stream system or interaction for days, now it finally shows this potential. It is as if the NAM follows a day behind the GFS and the GFS follows a day behind the EC. I think we just need to watch the EC to see what is really going to happen. The GFS just gives you old news a day later most of the time.

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The GFS has been hysterically horrible with this potential so far for this storm at the end of the week. First it focused on the northern stream system with no sign of a southern stream system or interaction for days, now it finally shows this potential. It is as if the NAM follows a day behind the GFS and the GFS follows a day behind the EC. I think we just need to watch the EC to see what is really going to happen. The GFS just gives you old news a day later most of the time.

I don't know whether i can agree with this or not.

ECM was originally showing a system effecting the Mid Atlantic into the NE with a snowstorm/ice storm at 144 hrs ..only to have it last night slide south and east OTS... And then develop a storm from energy left behind for hours 168-192....

It seems like the ECM is having its shares of struggles as well....

It just may be that the cold air will be too suppressive for this time period...

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Well, if you look at it that the EC at least had the potential coming from the southern stream and not the northern stream like the GFS did, then the differences with the EC are in the details. The differences with the GFS over the past couple of days have been hysterical in comparison. The EC had and still has potential coming from the southern stream at some point starting on Friday. The details will just have to wait, but at the least the EC gives you a realistic idea of what to watch out for.

I don't know whether i can agree with this or not.

ECM was originally showing a system effecting the Mid Atlantic into the NE with a snowstorm/ice storm at 144 hrs ..only to have it last night slide south and east OTS... And then develop a storm from energy left behind for hours 168-192....

It seems like the ECM is having its shares of struggles as well....

It just may be that the cold air will be too suppressive for this time period...

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Well, if you look at it that the EC at least had the potential coming from the southern stream and not the northern stream like the GFS did, then the differences with the EC are in the details. The differences with the GFS over the past couple of days have been hysterical in comparison. The EC had and still has potential coming from the southern stream at some point starting on Friday. The details will just have to wait, but at the least the EC gives you a realistic idea of what to watch out for.

Exactly. if you compare 12z today to 00z last night, the changes are just hysterical. GFS had a little nusince clipper dropping like .1-.25" over us last night, now it has a nice juicy system just south of us.

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Well, if you look at it that the EC at least had the potential coming from the southern stream and not the northern stream like the GFS did, then the differences with the EC are in the details. The differences with the GFS over the past couple of days have been hysterical in comparison. The EC had and still has potential coming from the southern stream at some point starting on Friday. The details will just have to wait, but at the least the EC gives you a realistic idea of what to watch out for.

Well yesterday at 12 Z the ECM mean seemed to suggest more of a Miller B set up

As you see one low over SW NY and a secondary along the coast...

And then it was yesterday at 18 Z that the GFS showed the same type scenario for the first time , as the ECM means.

So then last night it totally changed up on the 00z ECM...

While the GFS kept to its same theme from 18 Z..

So basically thats why i say it seems like all models are having there difficulties ...and probably why HPC says all models solutions are suspect...

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yes true, but its not just south, it Well south and out to sea, and it has support from the ensembles which isnt good at all.

The GFS could have a low in Cuba 6 days out and it wouldn't matter much. The GFS outside of 84 hours should be viewed as entertainment purposes only.

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You bring some good points however I was speaking only of the operational runs of the models. Anyway, there is a reason that the EC has the highest verification scores and remember that the EC usually does better with southern stream dominated systems and the GFS often does better with northern stream dominated systems, so this one goes to the EC in my opinion. The consistency of the operational EC with this potential has been much better than the operational GFS in my opinion. I am not however speaking for the means of those models.

Well yesterday at 12 Z the ECM mean seemed to suggest more of a Miller B set up

As you see one low over SW NY and a secondary along the coast...

And then it was yesterday at 18 Z that the GFS showed the same type scenario for the first time , as the ECM means.

So then last night it totally changed up on the 00z ECM...

While the GFS kept to its same theme from 18 Z..

So basically thats why i say it seems like all models are having there difficulties ...and probably why HPC says all models solutions are suspect...

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You bring some good points however I was speaking only of the operational runs of the models. Anyway, there is a reason that the EC has the highest verification scores and remember that the EC usually does better with southern stream dominated systems and the GFS often does better with northern stream dominated systems, so this one goes to the EC in my opinion. The consistency of the operational EC with this potential has been much better than the operational GFS in my opinion. I am not however speaking for the means of those models.

I guess if you want to get technical ..the UKMET at day 5 is on top the way it looks and then its followed by the GFS/ECM very closely..but what is even more impressive IMHO is how the NOGAPS is up right underneath them..

I am not saying that a storm can not happen ..but at the present time all indications point to this sliding to the south and east and there is not much support for the later system that the ECM was showing...Can this pattern produce? Of course it can..but at the same time it does not mean it has to...

The cold air could be just to suppressive and that could be a reason that this would slip to the south and to the east...

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