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January Forecast Discussion


REDMK6GLI

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Indicies forecast does not support a prolonged cold spell here AO forecasted to go positive - NAO remain positive and PNA forecasted to go negative again

 

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/daily_ao_index/ao.sprd2.gif

 

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/nao.sprd2.gif

 

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/pna.sprd2.gif

If the pattern busts then it busts, there's nothing we could do about it. EPO will still be negative though so I expect it to overrule the negative indices like it did in December and it'll eventually lead to at least a couple of decent snow events. Wall to wall cold is becoming more unlikely but really how often do we get wall to wall cold anyway. 

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If the pattern busts then it busts, there's nothing we could do about it. EPO will still be negative though so I expect it to overrule the negative indices like it did in December and it'll eventually lead to at least a couple of decent snow events. Wall to wall cold is becoming more unlikely but really how often do we get wall to wall cold anyway. 

This.

 

It's interesting how so many people I talk to are worn out by the cold and, yet, really, this month has been nowhere near as severe as the Januaries of 1977,1978,1979,1981,1982,1984 and 1994, at least here in Toronto. I think Canadians have lost their legendary resilience to the cold. In January 1977, for example, as well as February 1979, this city apparently experienced week after week of severe cold, not the two or three day shots of cold that this month has provided.

 

One thing is for sure, I don't think the cost of this cold shot is going to equal that of a major hurricane.

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If the pattern busts then it busts, there's nothing we could do about it. EPO will still be negative though so I expect it to overrule the negative indices like it did in December and it'll eventually lead to at least a couple of decent snow events. Wall to wall cold is becoming more unlikely but really how often do we get wall to wall cold anyway. 

we don't want extreme cold here - extreme cold limits the chances of significant snowstorms we want the PV to stay further north in a more favorable position for snow events around here....

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GFS 12z trended slightly NW from 6zf84.gif

Was just about to post. Don't be surprised from the jersey coast onto Long Island if you snow

Tues nite into Wednesday. Sometimes these arctic fronts like to snow right on the coast

You can see at 84 hours slp is just east of hatteras. With minus 15 air just need a little jog NW

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GFS squashes the late week clipper. Nothing like the Euro/ Euro ensemble mean.

Good spot for the GFS. The last 2 runs were off the CNJ coast , could miss , but when u see the GFS south and east

5 to 6 days out , you would think it could trend towards the euro ensembles.

Nothing set in stone. Models see em and lose everyday. But keep an eye on that. The trough axis looks better at day 6

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If the pattern busts then it busts, there's nothing we could do about it. EPO will still be negative though so I expect it to overrule the negative indices like it did in December and it'll eventually lead to at least a couple of decent snow events. Wall to wall cold is becoming more unlikely but really how often do we get wall to wall cold anyway. 

 

Our pattern of cold here has been coming in relatively short bursts compared to the longer duration stuff of days old.

Notice how the middle of the month warmed up so the early and late month Arctic shots were separated.

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Weren't the euro ensembles just 1-3" anyway though with this system?

Weren't the euro ensembles just 1-3" anyway though with this system?

The control was 3 to 6 and the ensemble mean was deeper and had a tighter track. Didn't see the QPF

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I suggest not looking at the gfs past the 28th..forget easing of the cold..its downright balmy

gee that kind of matches the new indicies forecasts today - neg PNA positive AO and Positive NAO in this + TNH patttern when the PV heads back north the southeast ridge takes over and it gets balmy around here ..........we have experienced this twice this winter already

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At the very least, I would think this simply won't be an epic snowy period....probably not an epic cold period either. Hopefully something changes, but with no significant storm threats showing up, as well as frigid cold that doesn't seem to want to last too much longer than 1 week....it's safer to just not expect much

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Upon further review Canada stays cold. So ths looks like it wants to transitions into what the Jma sees a gradient look. It happened in Feb 94 and what happens is u open up the pac for systems to come east through the CONUs and they ride the baroclinic zone. If it sets up over the Mason Dixon line ur in biz if it's over the Merritt then it's not good. But non of ths happening before 10 days of cold. 5 days of transition and then may a gradient as per Jma. Winter Far from over. Careful with the indicies. As long as the waters are warmer south of Alaska u will continue to build pressure there and Canada doesn't torch. So the cold may never b far away in Feb

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Upon further review Canada stays cold. So ths looks like it wants to transitions into what the Jma sees a gradient look. It happened in Feb 94 and what happens is u open up the pac for systems to come east through the CONUs and they ride the baroclinic zone. If it sets up over the Mason Dixon line ur in biz if it's over the Merritt then it's not good. But non of ths happening before 10 days of cold. 5 days of transition and then may a gradient as per Jma. Winter Far from over. Careful with the indicies. As long as the waters are warmer south of Alaska u will continue to build pressure there and Canada doesn't torch. So the cold may never b far away in Feb

Example: by looking at this 500mb map you would think a SE ridge and 564dm and a low pressure vorticity SW of us, you would think rain, but the low level cold air is winning in this situation preventing torch in NYC, 2/11/94 was an underrated snowstorm.

 

The point im trying to make is the GFS losing all the cold after 192 hrs, the GFS is notoriously volatile after this time period and either drops a PV full into the CONUS or has a raging SE ridge, my gut feeling in the beginning of Feb is a gradient pattern with low level cold air sticking around (verbatim the GFS has -20C at 850mb for 36 hours in NYC, that is very dense arctic air and will be very tough to get rid of)021115.png

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I fully expect the winter cancel and weenie suicide posts to begin at 18z if not sooner.

Its like when the reputable members post " models are going to be flipping and not forecasting accurately because of the pattern change " it magically is forgotten and winter cancel posts start poppin up lol. Apparantely december 2010 pattern isnt ideal if it produces when the cold relaxes

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Example: by looking at this 500mb map you would think a SE ridge and a low pressure vorticity SW of us, you would think rain, but the low level air is winning in this situation preventing torch in NYC, 2/11/94 was an underrated snowstorm.

 

The point im trying to make is the GFS losing all the cold after 192 hrs, the GFS is notoriously volatile after this time period and either drops a PV full into the CONUS or has a raging SE ridge, my gut feeling in the beginning of Feb is a gradient pattern with low level cold air sticking around (verbatim the GFS has -20C at 850mb for 36 hours in NYC, that is very dense arctic air and will be very tough to get rid of)021115.png

As long as the EPO is neg u are going to feed low level cold air into the bottom of the trough. But u can see the ridge coming back. So there's Def resistance there to the cold press. It's 15 days out so will sort detes then. 10 days of cold and SW s. Let's see if 1 can stick.

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As long as the EPO is neg u are going to feed low level cold air into the bottom of the trough. But u can see the ridge coming back. So there's Def resistance there to the cold press. It's 15 days out so will sort detes then. 10 days of cold and SW s. Let's see if 1 can stick.

I honestly would be suprised if we didnt get one widespread SECS in this pattern, It is ripe once the PV reloads. We just have to get used to the cold/dry and yes the winter cancel posts as well before we start trackin legit threats in our region

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