• Member Statistics

    15,889
    Total Members
    7,904
    Most Online
    bmoremdwx
    Newest Member
    bmoremdwx
    Joined

Recommended Posts

Just now, Jonger said:

The U.S. and U.K are like 10 countries in one. 

There's no apples to apples comparison being displayed here.

Those are cases per million, so they’ve been adjusted for population.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, RobertSul said:

Those are cases per million, so they’ve been adjusted for population.

Demographics.

Pop up a daily plane flight path map of the world.

global-air-traffic-map.gif?zoom=2.625&re

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyway we had the first couple of people at work so far as known confirmed with C19 and one is pretty sick.  Different department to mine. Unknown what the org’s response is going to look like

  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No they weren't. Whoever gave you this information is wrong, and that 'company' you know was probably breaking the law.

We never stopped operations in Michigan. Honestly man I’m a supply chain analyst, I think I’d know if I were facilitating the transfer of goods in Michigan or not. In fact we did one project in Saginaw and another in Kalamazoo.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Exactly. So who are these people who are suffering. Sure there might be someone out there that is but every measure possible is being done to make sure that isn't the case and furthermore some are even making more with this happening which is a whole different horrible issue. But to that point people have money and will spend when this opens. So the economy tanking is on speculation by people who profit off speculation. 

Service industry people mostly. Retail, airlines, hospitality and dining have been absolutely gutted. Mother works at one of the bigger hotels in Detroit and told me that Las Vegas is basically unemployed. In addition here in Charleston we’ve already lost $1 Billion economically and tons of service industry people have no money
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Stebo said:

But it only impacts the old........... again people need to read more before coming along saying it's only impacting the old or even killing just the old. And even if it is killing those who have a preexisting condition. Last I checked having these symptoms for 2 months isn't a walk in the park.

Even though the elderly and/or immune-suppressed are the most prevalent victims, I will reiterate my earlier post. I personally know two middle-aged, previously perfectly healthy victims who are probably going to recover, but have gone through hell on earth. One was in the hospital for three and a half weeks and she is still recovering at home two weeks later. The other is on his fifth week in the hospital, not yet close to getting out, and spent a long time on a ventilator. Argue all you want about the economic impacts, the impact on business and industry, politicize it all you want, but it's not the common flu boys and girls. There is no vaccine or antidote.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, IWXwx said:

Even though the elderly and/or immune-suppressed are the most prevalent victims, I will reiterate my earlier post. I personally know two middle-aged, previously perfectly healthy victims who are probably going to recover, but have gone through hell on earth. One was in the hospital for three and a half weeks and she is still recovering at home two weeks later. The other is on his fifth week in the hospital, not yet close to getting out, and spent a long time on a ventilator. Argue all you want about the economic impacts, the impact on business and industry, politicize it all you want, but it's not the common flu boys and girls. There is no vaccine or antidote.

Yeah agree 100% the danger is there for everyone and eve. If you aren't dying if you catch it, it is horrible if you are symptomatic.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, nwohweather said:


We never stopped operations in Michigan. Honestly man I’m a supply chain analyst, I think I’d know if I were facilitating the transfer of goods in Michigan or not. In fact we did one project in Saginaw and another in Kalamazoo.

Who is 'we' and what industry is 'we', that makes a huge difference in the conversation.

1 hour ago, nwohweather said:


Service industry people mostly. Retail, airlines, hospitality and dining have been absolutely gutted. Mother works at one of the bigger hotels in Detroit and told me that Las Vegas is basically unemployed. In addition here in Charleston we’ve already lost $1 Billion economically and tons of service industry people have no money

But the money is lost only in principle, the money will be spent once things open up because a lot of people are sitting on liquidity right now. Anyone that is working or even collecting unemployment. The latter of which covers many of those service industry workers.

Vegas obviously is a different ball of wax because of the gaming industry though so I will give credit on that one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
But the money is lost only in principle, the money will be spent once things open up because a lot of people are sitting on liquidity right now. Anyone that is working or even collecting unemployment. The latter of which covers many of those service industry workers.
Vegas obviously is a different ball of wax because of the gaming industry though so I will give credit on that one.

People are burning through liquidity, fixed it for you. Unemployment is impossible to get almost because so many are trying to sign up, so many are seeing significant delays. Hell my sister runs a Hampton Inn around the Sandusky, OH area and she said they’ve laid everyone off but her and the Assistant GM. Laid off employees are coming and eating the continental breakfast so they don’t go hungry that’s how bad it is.

Having 30 million people lose their entire incomes and then more than likely having to enter a new industry is going to be devastating for the rest of the year to our economy.
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, nwohweather said:


People are burning through liquidity, fixed it for you. Unemployment is impossible to get almost because so many are trying to sign up, so many are seeing significant delays. Hell my sister runs a Hampton Inn around the Sandusky, OH area and she said they’ve laid everyone off but her and the Assistant GM. Laid off employees are coming and eating the continental breakfast so they don’t go hungry that’s how bad it is.

Having 30 million people lose their entire incomes and then more than likely having to enter a new industry is going to be devastating for the rest of the year to our economy.

That just isn't true if they are getting unemployment 960 a week before taxes per worker, if that is not enough money especially if both spouses are work and/or on unemployment they are living beyond their means. Those who aren't getting unemployment because delays are going to get it and get it backdated so the missing money will be there. That is more of an issue of gross negligence at a state level, thankfully this state has done much better than others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Stebo said:

That just isn't true if they are getting unemployment 960 a week before taxes per worker, if that is not enough money especially if both spouses are work and/or on unemployment they are living beyond their means. Those who aren't getting unemployment because delays are going to get it and get it backdated so the missing money will be there. That is more of an issue of gross negligence at a state level, thankfully this state has done much better than others.

I think that the sad reality is that a strong amount of people do live beyond their means.   

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stebo remember how last month people realized Florida had basically designed its UI system, to deny people access to UI. Pretty much the whole country is like that, only less blatant.  Like Ohio just rolled out a website so your employer can conveniently report you as ineligible on account of having “refused work” 

  • Confused 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many years ago I got into a claim denial related to an H&S issue with an employer and it basically resolved via standoff of: you can report it as decline to accept work and I’ll report it to OSHA, and we can have it adjudicated. that was a large pain in the butt and i wasn’t worried about making rent

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, Snownado said:

Don't viruses normally fade away this time of year ? Why would this virus be any different ?

Novel virus that spreads easily.  There could be a bit of a seasonal aspect but I think how we decide to live in the coming months is going to be the bigger factor in what happens.  

imo, having restrictions in colder temps vs having little or no restrictions in warmer temps would actually result in more cases in the latter scenario.  I think any seasonal aspect just gets drowned out at a certain point.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, sokolow said:

Stebo remember how last month people realized Florida had basically designed its UI system, to deny people access to UI. Pretty much the whole country is like that, only less blatant.  Like Ohio just rolled out a website so your employer can conveniently report you as ineligible on account of having “refused work” 

Well in that case then we are truly ****ed. These are the same states and companies crying for money too. There needs to be a complete change in the way business is done after this because that is just gross negligence

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, RyanDe680 said:

I think that the sad reality is that a strong amount of people do live beyond their means.   

I do agree there. Personally I don't though because being single for a good amount of my life, I know that if something happens to me and I am not prepared, I am ****ed.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, nwohweather said:


People are burning through liquidity, fixed it for you. Unemployment is impossible to get almost because so many are trying to sign up, so many are seeing significant delays. Hell my sister runs a Hampton Inn around the Sandusky, OH area and she said they’ve laid everyone off but her and the Assistant GM. Laid off employees are coming and eating the continental breakfast so they don’t go hungry that’s how bad it is.

Having 30 million people lose their entire incomes and then more than likely having to enter a new industry is going to be devastating for the rest of the year to our economy.

  That's the price you pay when an economy of production moves to an economy of service.  Once you base your economy on consumption instead of production there's nothing to support it when demand for services hits the basement.  A "Service" based economy is just that, it serves.  We haven't had a "production" or "goods" based economy in 40 or 50 years.  At least if you have a production based economy, when shit hits the fan, you can at least "make things" for yourself.  If your economy is based on service, it's artificial.  It's Bitcoin.  Walmart is the largest employer in this country (which is absolutely embarrassing).  What do they produce? 

  Not digging at you, I'm in the same boat.  I get it your a supply chain analyst.  Most people never heard of the "supply chain" in detail until it was brought up during this and may not understand completely what it is.  It's not just ships, ports trucks and/or warehouses. It's way deeper than the obvious on the surface.  But the supply chain doesn't "make" anything.  The supply chain creates jobs, but what flows through the supply chain has changed drastically over the last 40 years.   Just like what  I do for a living it doesn't "produce" a product that can be built or sold. I support a product or products that have already been built and sold.  

   This country is at a true crossroads right now, for that matter the world is.  The divisions are already deep, and like the stock market, are artificially being exasperated by selfish entities trying to exploit them at our expense for their own profit.  We are facing something now that typical American denial isn't going to work.  We're going to have to deal with it for a long time.  The economic game that's been played by us world wide, the fact that we have dollar stores, the fact that we in this country get the best deals without making shit at the expense of impoverished slaves exploited by the the "walmarts" of the world.     None of us can, nor should we, rely on the current leadership or the future leadership, to get us as a country through this.  We need to stand up, and do the hard thing, but on our terms, not the fat cats.  The economy is important, but this current economy isn't worth sacrificing lives for IMHO  This is a crucial time right now in our society.  We've been a junkie ignoring reality long enough.  I hope our kids and grandkids won't have to forgive us and may thank us instead. 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Jackstraw said:

  That's the price you pay when an economy of production moves to an economy of service.  Once you base your economy on consumption instead of production there's nothing to support it when demand for services hits the basement.  A "Service" based economy is just that, it serves.  We haven't had a "production" or "goods" based economy in 40 or 50 years.  At least if you have a production based economy, when shit hits the fan, you can at least "make things" for yourself.  If your economy is based on service, it's artificial.  It's Bitcoin.  Walmart is the largest employer in this country (which is absolutely embarrassing).  What do they produce? 

  Not digging at you, I'm in the same boat.  I get it your a supply chain analyst.  Most people never heard of the "supply chain" in detail until it was brought up during this and may not understand completely what it is.  It's not just ships, ports trucks and/or warehouses. It's way deeper than the obvious on the surface.  But the supply chain doesn't "make" anything.  The supply chain creates jobs, but what flows through the supply chain has changed drastically over the last 40 years.   Just like what  I do for a living it doesn't "produce" a product that can be built or sold. I support a product or products that have already been built and sold.  

   This country is at a true crossroads right now, for that matter the world is.  The divisions are already deep, and like the stock market, are artificially being exasperated by selfish entities trying to exploit them at our expense for their own profit.  We are facing something now that typical American denial isn't going to work.  We're going to have to deal with it for a long time.  The economic game that's been played by us world wide, the fact that we have dollar stores, the fact that we in this country get the best deals without making shit at the expense of impoverished slaves exploited by the the "walmarts" of the world.     None of us can, nor should we, rely on the current leadership or the future leadership, to get us as a country through this.  We need to stand up, and do the hard thing, but on our terms, not the fat cats.  The economy is important, but this current economy isn't worth sacrificing lives for IMHO  This is a crucial time right now in our society.  We've been a junkie ignoring reality long enough.  I hope our kids and grandkids won't have to forgive us and may thank us instead. 

You bring up a great point with your last paragraph, my dad is making more at home than working right now even after 35 years being a welder for the same shop. This is a bargaining chip that the middle and lower class need to use because in no way shape or form should one make more at home than working. Even in this special circumstance, companies coming out on the other side need to be paying their workers more especially because this isn't going to be any easier when those who aren't working go back to work.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Stebo said:

Well in that case then we are truly ****ed. These are the same states and companies crying for money too. There needs to be a complete change in the way business is done after this because that is just gross negligence

A friend of mine in CA hasn’t seen the federal UI supplement yet, theoretical max benefit is 450/wk (if you make 100k, he didnt, so his is less). Spouse discovered her UI is strangled at 100/wk because she is being incorrectly penalized for a reporting error from a year ago that was supposedly favorably resolved, but, good luck getting ahold of anyone to get that fixed. That in turn seems to be affecting her federal UI supplement, and ...

Another friend in CA is furloughed / on reduced hours, not unemployed.  Which is good, but also bad.  Because that means the state has to process the employer derived notice that hours have been reduced but they want to retain the employee, and,

Another friend in Canada is stuck in a phone tree living nightmare, and can’t discern what is going on with his claim, what crack it fell through, or what is happening.

At any rate one can imagine how this stacks up against the rent on their (modest, financially responsible) residences in the greater Bay or Toronto areas.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pew Research had a good article on how many unemployed persons were actually able to claim and receive UI benefits, back in March before it really got spicy.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/04/24/not-all-unemployed-people-get-unemployment-benefits-in-some-states-very-few-do/ft_20-04-16_unemploymentbenefits_2/

“Largely because state rules vary so much, the share of people the government counts as unemployed who actually receive unemployment benefits varies too. In March, just before the pandemic really began wreaking havoc on the economy, 65.9% of unemployed Massachusetts residents received benefit payments but only 7.6% of jobless Floridians did, according to Pew Research Center’s analysis of data”

The neutral way of putting this I suppose, is to say that UI systems are generally speaking, stringently designed to ensure that claimants meet and can demonstrate eligibility criteria such as no-fault discharge and availability for, willingness to take, and active search for employment. Its intended as an emergency supplement to savings, not a replacement for lost wages. The level of stringency can be seen state by state in the Pew graphic below.  This stance has not synergized well with the current situation of many, and has affected access to the Federal supplement.

FB379A58-8EF1-4838-A9C3-64C830316FAC.thumb.png.ad4b887c5f7d6ea85343bb642437085f.png

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even accepting that stance, when you’re unemployed your full time job is 1. finding work and 2. strategizing how to stretch your financial resources.  It should not be to struggle with the UI system and starting packing your household cuz you fear you’ll be unable to make rent in the near to medium term.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, RyanDe680 said:

I think that the sad reality is that a strong amount of people do live beyond their means.   

Absolutely. Fiscal responsibility on a personal level needs to be taught in schools. The thing is, people get very touchy on the subject of their spending habits.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, RobertSul said:

Absolutely. Fiscal responsibility on a personal level needs to be taught in schools. The thing is, people get very touchy on the subject of their spending habits.

Perhaps the curriculum could be designed by the MBA programs which educated our business and financial leadership who in turn created the strong national enterprises that have had no need to seek emergency loans or grants either now or in 2007-9, because they wisely saved several months to a year of operating costs in order to weather financial crises, natural disasters, and pandemics

  • Weenie 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Stebo said:

I do agree there. Personally I don't though because being single for a good amount of my life, I know that if something happens to me and I am not prepared, I am ****ed.

As someone who manages money for a living, I wish everyone would think like that.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Jackstraw said:

  That's the price you pay when an economy of production moves to an economy of service.  Once you base your economy on consumption instead of production there's nothing to support it when demand for services hits the basement.  A "Service" based economy is just that, it serves.  We haven't had a "production" or "goods" based economy in 40 or 50 years.  At least if you have a production based economy, when shit hits the fan, you can at least "make things" for yourself.  If your economy is based on service, it's artificial.  It's Bitcoin.  Walmart is the largest employer in this country (which is absolutely embarrassing).  What do they produce? 

  Not digging at you, I'm in the same boat.  I get it your a supply chain analyst.  Most people never heard of the "supply chain" in detail until it was brought up during this and may not understand completely what it is.  It's not just ships, ports trucks and/or warehouses. It's way deeper than the obvious on the surface.  But the supply chain doesn't "make" anything.  The supply chain creates jobs, but what flows through the supply chain has changed drastically over the last 40 years.   Just like what  I do for a living it doesn't "produce" a product that can be built or sold. I support a product or products that have already been built and sold.  

   This country is at a true crossroads right now, for that matter the world is.  The divisions are already deep, and like the stock market, are artificially being exasperated by selfish entities trying to exploit them at our expense for their own profit.  We are facing something now that typical American denial isn't going to work.  We're going to have to deal with it for a long time.  The economic game that's been played by us world wide, the fact that we have dollar stores, the fact that we in this country get the best deals without making shit at the expense of impoverished slaves exploited by the the "walmarts" of the world.     None of us can, nor should we, rely on the current leadership or the future leadership, to get us as a country through this.  We need to stand up, and do the hard thing, but on our terms, not the fat cats.  The economy is important, but this current economy isn't worth sacrificing lives for IMHO  This is a crucial time right now in our society.  We've been a junkie ignoring reality long enough.  I hope our kids and grandkids won't have to forgive us and may thank us instead. 

Ugh, not the artificial stock market crap again.  The bottom line is that countries with the most wealth are typically not producing economies, they naturally become service oriented.  It's supply and demand - if you could produce a glass for $5 here but another country makes the exact same glass for $3, as a business that is a no brainer.  It's not the fault of the 'economy' but the fault of business if you want to place blame.  The stock market is the way that the general population can value certain companies with no intermediary.  We all individually have access to own these companies and during times of economic shock or stress, valuations never make sense.  The common thread is that rationalization always plays out and fair valuation eventually comes out.  The human psychology controls this, not an 'entity.' 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, sokolow said:

A friend of mine in CA hasn’t seen the federal UI supplement yet, theoretical max benefit is 450/wk (if you make 100k, he didnt, so his is less). Spouse discovered her UI is strangled at 100/wk because she is being incorrectly penalized for a reporting error from a year ago that was supposedly favorably resolved, but, good luck getting ahold of anyone to get that fixed. That in turn seems to be affecting her federal UI supplement, and ...

Another friend in CA is furloughed / on reduced hours, not unemployed.  Which is good, but also bad.  Because that means the state has to process the employer derived notice that hours have been reduced but they want to retain the employee, and,

Another friend in Canada is stuck in a phone tree living nightmare, and can’t discern what is going on with his claim, what crack it fell through, or what is happening.

At any rate one can imagine how this stacks up against the rent on their (modest, financially responsible) residences in the greater Bay or Toronto areas.

Gross incompetence of the Feds and how this has played out can't be ignored. That is for sure. By the way your 2nd example is what is happening to my mom, she is on reduced hours 20/week.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, sokolow said:

Pew Research had a good article on how many unemployed persons were actually able to claim and receive UI benefits, back in March before it really got spicy.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/04/24/not-all-unemployed-people-get-unemployment-benefits-in-some-states-very-few-do/ft_20-04-16_unemploymentbenefits_2/

“Largely because state rules vary so much, the share of people the government counts as unemployed who actually receive unemployment benefits varies too. In March, just before the pandemic really began wreaking havoc on the economy, 65.9% of unemployed Massachusetts residents received benefit payments but only 7.6% of jobless Floridians did, according to Pew Research Center’s analysis of data”

The neutral way of putting this I suppose, is to say that UI systems are generally speaking, stringently designed to ensure that claimants meet and can demonstrate eligibility criteria such as no-fault discharge and availability for, willingness to take, and active search for employment. Its intended as an emergency supplement to savings, not a replacement for lost wages. The level of stringency can be seen state by state in the Pew graphic below.  This stance has not synergized well with the current situation of many, and has affected access to the Federal supplement.

FB379A58-8EF1-4838-A9C3-64C830316FAC.thumb.png.ad4b887c5f7d6ea85343bb642437085f.png

There is definitely an undeniable pattern to that map, not only by location but by political party of the states.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.