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42 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

There's something I've been wondering.  It's a bit nuanced but maybe our resident doctor can answer.

The vaccines have shown to be tremendously successful in preventing severe disease/hospitalization.  But this would largely be in a world with mask wearing and other precautions, such as social distancing. 

Sometime in the future, let's say someone who has been vaccinated is in church and near someone who wasn't vaccinated and is carrying covid and singing.  Neither party is wearing a mask.  Would being exposed to a higher viral load make it harder for that person's vaccine-acquired protection to deal with?  Is there sound logic behind the idea that an initial high viral exposure may be more likely to make a vaccinated person seriously ill?

MD student here - I think based on the data we have so far and what we know about related vaccines (e.g. influenza, for which very few people wear masks to avoid infection) that the vaccinated individual in your scenario would still receive some degree of protection. I think it’s a fair analogy to picture the vaccine as having a net effect of reducing the exposed viral load - i.e. even if immune cells ultimately can’t fully neutralize a high exposure they should still be able to clear a certain amount of the virus. So if we can assume that exposed viral load corresponds to eventual severity of disease (obvi not a perfect assumption but seems pretty well-supported by existing data), then of course vaccine+mask is more protective than vaccine alone, but even vaccine alone should be more protective than no vaccination at all.

This is probably the reason why - even as capacity limits, etc are being lifted -  wearing a mask in general settings where you don’t know who is/isn’t immune will continue to be recommended while COVID is still circulating. Because as you mentioned, all of this very promising data is in the context of mask-wearing and other precautions, and the vaccines might appear to be less effective in the absence of those other actions.

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2 hours ago, cyclone77 said:

14hrs after the 2nd moderna shot at 1:30 this morning I woke up with teeth chattering chills.  Had 102 fever.  Fever seems gone this am but feel pretty weak/blah.  

The first shot only resulted in a sore shoulder on day 2/3.

Lots of stories about the 2nd shot causing more of a reaction.  I don't remember reading any accounts of the 1st shot causing more side effects than the 2nd.  

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23 hours ago, Jonger said:

Took a 5 mile hike on the outskirts of Ann Arbor (heavily liberal) and people hiking in the middle of the woods were wearing masks. Leaving metro Detroit you hardly see anyone wearing them outside of large chain stores and certainly not outside.

No lives were saved, it's just theater. He's right.

Lol that sounds terrible.  Probably the same people that wear them in their cars.  

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15 minutes ago, MJO812 said:

No clue why people wear a mask driving alone

 

I think it depends.  If you're running errands around town, perhaps you don't want to keep putting it on and taking it off.  I have left it on in the car sometimes when doing that.  If you're driving on the interstate by yourself, yeah, no reason to have it on.

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The CEO of Texas Roadhouse committed suicide.  When I first saw the story I figured it was because of financial problems due to the pandemic, but it is being attributed to his long-hauler covid symptoms.  This could be an issue going forward (in addition to suicides brought on by the difficulties from the pandemic), as there are many people out there with long-hauler covid.  Interestingly, there are some anecdotal reports of the covid vaccines helping to alleviate some people's long-hauler covid symptoms.  Not sure what the mechanism would be for that (maybe "recalibrates" the immune system somehow?) but it deserves more investigation.  

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Just now, schoeppeya said:

There was someone a few pages back that speculated we would end up with below average  mortality this year... will be interesting to see if that trend continues 

According to reddit, " there’s just a 4-6 weeks lag in reporting for this dataset. So the most recent 4-6 weeks always look like they’re below the average. If you look at it again in a month, deaths from those weeks will almost certainly be at or above the average. "

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Lol that sounds terrible.  Probably the same people that wear them in their cars.  
Why do you care so much? It's not hurting you. On the other hand, if someone doesn't wear a mask in a crowded area and has asymptomatic covid they could infect others. It's a simple matter of compassion and empathy. I truly don't understand the mask debate.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

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On 3/21/2021 at 10:59 AM, Hoosier said:

Lots of stories about the 2nd shot causing more of a reaction.  I don't remember reading any accounts of the 1st shot causing more side effects than the 2nd.  

Yeah I was kind of ready for it, def didn't disappoint lol.

By early evening yesterday I was pretty much back to normal.  Today I feel fantastic. :tomato:

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26 minutes ago, StormfanaticInd said:

Good numbers here in Indiana 

20210322_145109.jpg

I can't even remember the last time we had 1 death.  Maybe back in summer or very early fall.  Although it is unusual to only see 1 day of deaths in the update (in this case 3/18)... usually it's a range of days.

We have been relatively plateaued on cases in Indiana for a while, but now the positivity rate is also showing signs of plateauing.  We're at a crossroads... do we stay like this or start to go up as is happening in some other states.

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On 3/21/2021 at 6:11 PM, schoeppeya said:

There was someone a few pages back that speculated we would end up with below average  mortality this year... will be interesting to see if that trend continues 

That was me. I made that call with no data, just figured we have a more hardy population after COVID did it's culling.

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9 hours ago, MJO812 said:

Numbers in NJ are getting worse

 

At this point I don't think we can vaccinate fast enough to avoid a rise in cases nationally.  A number of states have been rising lately with the national numbers generally plateaued.  We saw the scenes out of Miami on spring break, but that is only a glimpse.  People are letting their guard down and you throw in more transmissable variants and it is set up to see a rise.  Now, it won't be as deadly this time because so many vulnerable have been vaccinated, but we just have to get through the next month or two until more vaccinations and summer type weather sets in in more of the country.

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1 hour ago, Hoosier said:

At this point I don't think we can vaccinate fast enough to avoid a rise in cases nationally.  A number of states have been rising lately with the national numbers generally plateaued.  We saw the scenes out of Miami on spring break, but that is only a glimpse.  People are letting their guard down and you throw in more transmissable variants and it is set up to see a rise.  Now, it won't be as deadly this time because so many vulnerable have been vaccinated, but we just have to get through the next month or two until more vaccinations and summer type weather sets in in more of the country.

There will be a slight plateau this month in cases, but then another gradual decline. We're vaccinating people far too fast for their to be another "wave". Those in serious condition have been declining everyday the last few months.  

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