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16 hours ago, Wmsptwx said:

It’s really really bad at local hospital my mom works at. Literally at capacity and starting to be thinking of ideas for unit outside of hospital and or opening defunct hospital small distance away to use. It’s very bad and trending worse.

Almost 5000 hospitalized now in PA (+238 today). 7700 new cases today.

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4 hours ago, OSUmetstud said:

I think the choke point is intensive care and not regular hospital beds. 

https://www.aha.org/statistics/fast-facts-us-hospitals

 

Screenshot_20201202-101824_Chrome.jpg

It’s not. The choke point is when you overcome the hospital or it starts reaching capacity. Currently, area hospitals here are about 80-85% full. That’s not a common number for this early into winter. That’s a number in January-February during the height of flu season. 

It’s not just ICU beds, because every hospital has some people in it who are COVID but haven’t reached the need for ICU intervention, or are bad enough to need care but not need ICU level care. 

When you are overcoming local resources and there is no more room when it becomes a problem. There is a trickle-down effect from the start of illness, depending upon the severity of the individual. The more that have moderate to major symptoms, the more strain that is applied to the local healthcare system both pre-hospital (EMS), hospital, and post-hospital. This isn’t a one shoe fits all type of scenario. It can be drastically different across different geographic and socioeconomic areas. 

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If symptom onset is typically 3+ days, I would think that starting around now forward some of the testing will begin from Thanksgiving.  Who knows how long those results will take however, so I am thinking the low point a couple of days ago(mostly due to data backlog) is probably the lowest we will see for a while.

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1 minute ago, hardypalmguy said:

It’s really hitting the fan in Wisconsin and the Republican legislature wants to pass legislation to absolve all businesses and schools of liability for COVID along with forcing all schools to be in person by end of January full time no matter what!


.

Smh. America is just failing miserably 

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Really not looking good today. We were less than 10 deaths below the record in April yesterday and looks like we’ll shoot over that today with big states not yet in. Part of it’s backlog from the holiday but the hospitalization trends mean the death tolls will keep going up for probably 2 weeks even if the hospitalizations stop increasing today. That plus overwhelmed hospitals mean more will die than need to. Horrible. The vaccines can’t come soon enough, but it won’t be in time to help in the cold season when they’re really needed. It’ll really help starting when the weather warms up. 

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Encouraging that the measures taken in Europe are reducing the daily new cases there and will reduce the death tolls soon. Hopefully the same can happen here but the holidays, fatigue and “the vaccine’s coming so we can relax”, and lack of National strategy might shoot us in the foot. Hopefully not. Europe had more centralized and strict measures taken. 

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3 minutes ago, jm1220 said:

Encouraging that the measures taken in Europe are reducing the daily new cases there and will reduce the death tolls soon. Hopefully the same can happen here but the holidays, fatigue and “the vaccine’s coming so we can relax”, and lack of National strategy might shoot us in the foot. Hopefully not. Europe had more centralized and strict measures taken. 

Whats hurting America is the lack of leadership.

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7 minutes ago, jm1220 said:

Encouraging that the measures taken in Europe are reducing the daily new cases there and will reduce the death tolls soon. Hopefully the same can happen here but the holidays, fatigue and “the vaccine’s coming so we can relax”, and lack of National strategy might shoot us in the foot. Hopefully not. Europe had more centralized and strict measures taken. 

Seems like there are 2 camps about the vaccine.  One is that the vaccine is coming, so let's buckle down for a while until it gets here.  The other one is what you said... the vaccine is coming, so who cares what happens in the interim. 

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Just came in with 4600 cases here in Mass. ugh. Looks like some of that may have been a backlog from yesterday though, but positivity is trending up, (~7% if college tests are excluded). Still have relatively low hospitalizations per capita compared to most other states, including CT & RI to our south. RI just opened a field hospital today.

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1 hour ago, StormfanaticInd said:

More like mid January at the earliest. 2 doses separated by 4 weeks #Edit Make that the end of January 

I would argue even beyond that.  It is something that needs to be monitored over a period of time.  Say that the first round of shots is in mid to late December.  Then the second dose happens in early to mid January.  I think end of January to end of February could really be the telling month in nursing homes and when you would expect to see plummeting rates of infection among staff and residents.

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8 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

I would argue even beyond that.  It is something that needs to be monitored over a period of time.  Say that the first round of shots is in mid to late December.  Then the second dose happens in early to mid January.  I think end of January to end of February could really be the telling month in nursing homes and when you would expect to see plummeting rates of infection among staff and residents.

Just have to hope we can pull this off logistically without any major hiccups 

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One issue with the vaccine right off the bat has to do with pregnant women.  There are a lot of women in healthcare with some fraction of them being pregnant.  Pfizer and Moderna did not enroll pregnant women in their trials, so there is no data for that group of people.  No data is not necessarily the same thing as not safe/effective, but are pregnant healthcare workers going to be forced to get vaccinated?  I could see that being problematic if some of them don't want to be vaccinated, and they'd be able to argue that hey, there is no data to back up this vaccine for me.

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42 minutes ago, Hoosier said:

One issue with the vaccine right off the bat has to do with pregnant women.  There are a lot of women in healthcare with some fraction of them being pregnant.  Pfizer and Moderna did not enroll pregnant women in their trials, so there is no data for that group of people.  No data is not necessarily the same thing as not safe/effective, but are pregnant healthcare workers going to be forced to get vaccinated?  I could see that being problematic if some of them don't want to be vaccinated, and they'd be able to argue that hey, there is no data to back up this vaccine for me.

Do we know that for a fact?  I didn’t see anything one way or another about pregnant women in trials.  

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