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Nearing the 2nd half of Meteorological winter:


Typhoon Tip

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1 minute ago, WinterWolf said:

Man the Euro so isn't what it used to be....Holy smokes.

To be fair, we're talking a D5-6 system here. We used to rarely even considering anything outside of D5 worth tracking seriously just a few years ago. But these days, we seem to track stuff from 10 days out and expectations get set...whether good or bad.

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I don't think that trend is done though - ...not that anyone said otherwise... straw man arguin'

The 00z Euro I thought was just hiccuping or something, pushing that negative tilt into the TV and then doing an 'almost' just on is...  Then I saw these 12z operational GFS/GGEM runs and well... there may be a need to watch that D5.5 - D7 range.  

There is also presentation of that time frame amid some of the various GEFs members ...

The stark differences between the 00z and 12z Euro wrt to the deep layer handling is probably more telling than what it is indicating on either run.  

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Its still out in eternity, Don't even have to look past today's storm that failed from inside 24 hrs, The GFS has been pretty steady though at this just being a FROPA for a few days, Time will tell as we get closer but most all guidance has shifted away from the full blown cutter scenario for now.

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7 minutes ago, Typhoon Tip said:

I don't think that trend is done though - ...not that anyone said otherwise... straw man arguin'

The 00z Euro I thought was just hiccuping or something, pushing that negative tilt into the TV and then doing an 'almost' just on is...  Then I saw these 12z operational GFS/GGEM runs and well... there may be a need to watch that D5.5 - D7 range.  

There is also presentation of that time frame amid some of the various GEFs members ...

The stark differences between the 00z and 12z Euro wrt to the deep layer handling is probably more telling than what it is indicating on either run.  

Wouldn't take a huge change now to introduce wintry precip into a good chunk of the forum on that system. We'll see if we can get lucky.

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21 minutes ago, WinterWolf said:

Man the Euro so isn't what it used to be....Holy smokes.

The whole "Euro is King" in years past was a little bit oversold anyway.  Maybe it was king for 6-10 years in a regime it could better handle and now tele's have shifted?  I dunno' maybeTip or one of the other long range Mets has some insight. 

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Meh, day 6 and beyond isn’t really worth getting into model sucks for this reason or that reason. Talk to me inside 3 days and especially 2 days. Euro wins that and that’s all I care about. Of course, one shouldn’t always run away with the solution verbatim...but more often than not...it has the right idea.

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8 minutes ago, HIPPYVALLEY said:

The whole "Euro is King" in years past was a little bit oversold anyway.  Maybe it was king for 6-10 years in a regime it could better handle and now tele's have shifted?  I dunno' maybeTip or one of the other long range Mets has some insight. 

Euro wheelhouse was always about D4 and inside that...esp 84 hours...we kind of really started hammering that model around 84 hours down to about 48 when the mesos became more useful. D6 was considered clown range a decade ago. D6-7 model forecasts have gotten a little more accurate since then but not nearly enough to justify the amount of attention that gets paid to D6-7 threats.

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That said, the Euro still performed better than other guidance at D5-6...it just was that scores across the board dropped off enough that those D6 forecasts weren't very reliable...even for the best scoring model. I recall so many systems where the Euro had a cutter at D6 and we didn't even really pay attention or worry at all...December 19, 2008 was one of them...36-48 hours later it was showing a SWFE with big snowfall and we started tracking it seriously inside of 100 hours.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, ORH_wxman said:

Euro wheelhouse was always about D4 and inside that...esp 84 hours...we kind of really started hammering that model around 84 hours down to about 48 when the mesos became more useful. D6 was considered clown range a decade ago. D6-7 model forecasts have gotten a little more accurate since then but not nearly enough to justify the amount of attention that gets paid to D6-7 threats.

Ok, thanks, that makes sense.  

 Do you feel like some Mesos  have become more reliable over the past 10 years?

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Basically what happens this go round is we are in a great region of the PV setup for STJ interaction with Nstream, core of cold stays in the mid of the country but the East Coast is primed for coastal interaction. Has the hallmarks of very active period of snow coming up. Eventually that core will rotate over us. I could see us averaging couple of degrees below normal or normal but way above snow the first 2 weeks of Feb then katy bar the door for the Arctic. That EPO look is extreme

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