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Second Half of October Wx Discussion?


CT Rain

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Yeah they were ice cold earlier so lets hope it continues.

I firmly believe and see it continuing to happen that the depth of the positive AO was forecasted wrong and warming in mid Nov will bring the AO into negative territory, the trend has steadily increased each day. By mid month the process should be in full motion for a distinctly colder pattern. Does not mean we do not continue the yo yo but seems to be the cold will become much more firmly established heading into Dec. JMHO

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I firmly believe and see it continuing to happen that the deptd of the positive AO was forecasted wrong and warming in mid Nov will bring the AO into negative territory, the trend has steadily increased each day. By mid month the process should be in full motion for a distinctly colder pattern. Does not mean we do not continue the yo yo but seems to be the cold will become much more firmly established heading into Dec. JMHO

careful! that limb you just went out on looks really dangerous. 

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Despite all the warm talk ...which is certainly valid, that sneaky weak snow signal from a norlun of all things is still showing up in the GFS.  Now, D4

 

Took a quick peek at the ensembles and many members have similar layouts...  That day is a short duration pop of probably the coldest air yet .. then the big warming trend commences

 

gfs_namer_108_1000_500_thick.gif

There is definitely a threat of interior elevation snows early next week.

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I don't really see any sign of a -AO or -NAO. It's locked + for a while which is fine. I see no reason why people are denying it or are scared on 10/30. Maybe later in November the +NAO weakens, but for now it's there. This is why I've been saying the Pacific is going to be much more important because we know the NAO is locked +. The Pacific is the bigger question mark and the good news is that any AK vortex is not appearing at the moment.

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I firmly believe and see it continuing to happen that the depth of the positive AO was forecasted wrong and warming in mid Nov will bring the AO into negative territory, the trend has steadily increased each day. By mid month the process should be in full motion for a distinctly colder pattern. Does not mean we do not continue the yo yo but seems to be the cold will become much more firmly established heading into Dec. JMHO

I don't see that negative AO signal. Where are you seeing that?

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Folks are hung up debating teleconnector modalities and it's all fascinating and all, but ... other area of interest is wind.   Looks like sustain 40+mph middle boundary layer flow on Friday.  Wonder what the gust potential is there, because we will be in warm sector ...well mixed environment that should be proficient for momentum transport.  That could be a jet engine day.

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Folks are hung up debating teleconnector modalities and it's all fascinating and all, but ... other area of interest is wind.   Looks like sustain 40+mph middle boundary layer flow on Friday.  Wonder what the gust potential is there, because we will be in warm sector ...well mixed environment that should be proficient for momentum transport.  That could a jet engine day.

overhead maybe, looks like a solid inversion cool season event, maybe we gust with embedded convection?

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I don't really see any sign of a -AO or -NAO. It's locked + for a while which is fine. I see no reason why people are denying it or are scared on 10/30. Maybe later in November the +NAO weakens, but for now it's there. This is why I've been saying the Pacific is going to be much more important because we know the NAO is locked +. The Pacific is the bigger question mark and the good news is that any AK vortex is not appearing at the moment.

I don"t think expressing an opinion is denying it either.

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Various model ENS, CFS, increasing number of Ens members pointing to a change Mid month, talking what would be day 15-20

 

Are there ensembles that are actually showing that happen or start to happen, or is it an interpretation of what they show and what you think would happen beyond the end of their runs?  I'm just trying to find some ensemble mean which might suggest a large scale shift from + to - AO or NAO.  Of course, we are all allowed to have our own interpretations and opinions. 

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overhead maybe, looks like a solid inversion cool season event, maybe we gust with embedded convection?

950-925 winds are certainly going to rip. when you start seeing 70 knots there that's good stuff. but certainly wouldn't describe it as a well-mixed environment. suppose it's not the same as having it happen in March when the profile is about as locked down with stability as it can be...but you're still tossing massive BL warmth northward and at best yielding a quasi-isothermal few thousand feet.

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Are there ensembles that are actually showing that happen or start to happen, or is it an interpretation of what they show and what you think would happen beyond the end of their runs?  I'm just trying to find some ensemble mean which might suggest a large scale shift from + to - AO or NAO.  Of course, we are all allowed to have our own interpretations and opinions. 

Standard deviation Ens charts show higher than normal heights appearing in Greenland and the Arctic circle. Individual Ens members show a weakening of the PV heading into that time period, will this trend continue? I do not know ,I posted yesterday that the trend of more members dropping the AO value had continued, todays 12Z ENS are not out so we will see. If I am wrong not worrying but like I said its JMHO. I will check back next week and change if required. As I said this is not discussing the mean but rather individual Ens members which may shift the mean in the future.

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I don"t think expressing an opinion is denying it either.

 

That's fine, but I get the sense people don't want to acknowledge the warmth. It's coming...people will have to deal. I take this as an opportunity to look ahead and know that the same pattern could certainly give us better chances of wintry wx in December. 

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That's fine, but I get the sense people don't want to acknowledge the warmth. It's coming...people will have to deal. I take this as an opportunity to look ahead and know that the same pattern could certainly give us better chances of wintry wx in December. 

I guess i missed that correlation, not getting that sense here anyways.

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overhead maybe, looks like a solid inversion cool season event, maybe we gust with embedded convection?

 

 

"Wonder what the gust potential is there, because we will be in warm sector ...well mixed environment that should be proficient for momentum transport."

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That's fine, but I get the sense people don't want to acknowledge the warmth. It's coming...people will have to deal. I take this as an opportunity to look ahead and know that the same pattern could certainly give us better chances of wintry wx in December. 

This warmth seems more like average temperatures to me for CNE and NNE other than this Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and maybe Sunday.  Is there a warm signal beyond that which I don't see?  Average highs should be around 50 degrees for CNE right?

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This warmth seems more like average temperatures to me for CNE and NNE other than this Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and maybe Sunday.  Is there a warm signal beyond that which I don't see?  Average highs should be around 50 degrees for CNE right?

 

 

2nd half of next week looks warm too...we'll be cold for a couple days early next week.

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