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Dec/Jan Medium/Long Range Disco


WinterWxLuvr
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14 minutes ago, dallen7908 said:

Yes, the 15-day mean in College Park is over an inch (1.1") for this first time this winter.

1"???

re: everyone else: tran·si·tion  1the process or a period of changing from one state or condition to another.

The Aleutian ridge is just starting to insert itself, so be careful for what happens next. 15 days away... 

lol 7 replies

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1 minute ago, Stormchaserchuck1 said:

1"???

re: everyone else: tran·si·tion  1the process or a period of changing from one state or condition to another.

The Aleutian ridge is just starting to insert itself, so be careful for what happens next. 15 days away... 

lol 7 replies

 

IMG_0179.webp

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Latest Euro weeklies for the week beyond the end of the 0z EPS run.

Dunno about an 'Aleutian island' ridge, but I like that amped EPO ridge in conjunction with a -NAO.  Not one word about -PNA. There is no big trough there and a slightly -PNA can actually be our friend in a Nino- think shortwaves ejecting eastward taking the southern route under a NA block. It is likely going to be a temporary feature in this case.

1705017600-GiCuMKSOxkE.png

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2 hours ago, osfan24 said:

No doubt. When PSU broke down how things might proceed from here, I cringed a bit. I know he still said late January-February could be the real deal, but potentially waiting until then after all the talk of virtual wall-to-wall -NAO and -AO and after so many seasons of nothingness and can-kicking.........whew, that would test us.

I’m sorry if I wasn’t clear. I think it’s very possible we get snow before late Jan. I was just saying the best window for a hecs level storm would be after the PAC pattern recycles. There are plenty of paths to get snow before that. 

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12 minutes ago, CAPE said:

Latest Euro weeklies for the week beyond the end of the 0z EPS run.

Dunno about an 'Aleutian island' ridge, but I like that amped EPO ridge in conjunction with a -NAO.  Not one word about -PNA. There is no big trough there and a slightly -PNA can actually be our friend in a Nino- think shortwaves ejecting eastward taking the southern route under a NA block. It is likely going to be a temporary feature in this case.

1705017600-GiCuMKSOxkE.png

That split flow with vorts sliding under the epo!!!....need the homer simpson drool pic!!

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2 hours ago, Stormchaserchuck1 said:

We have a good pattern setting up for Dec 29-Jan 2, then it looks like the Aleutian island ridge comes on strong hr384 on 12z GEFS. By the end of the run, the pattern is transitioning toward possibly a SE ridge. 

 

1 hour ago, clskinsfan said:

I dont know wtf he is talking about. There is no SE ridge anywhere on the GEFS.

If we had a positive AO or a Nina I’d share your worry. He means a week later that pac ridge would be trouble. But in a Nino with -AO and split flow it’s not the same. We discussed this yesterday. And the ridge is temporary.  In a strong Nino no way we get a prolonged Nina pacific long wave pattern. It’s a response to the mjo in the MC. It will come off before it significantly alters the equation. If I’m wrong and we get a prolonged pac ridge -pna eastern torch I will officially cancel winter forever and find a new hobby. 

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4 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

If we had a positive AO or a Nina I’d share your worry. He means a week later that pac ridge would be trouble. But in a Nino with -AO and split flow it’s not the same. We discussed this yesterday. And the ridge is temporary.  In a strong Nino no way we get a prolonged Nina pacific long wave pattern. It’s a response to the mjo in the MC. It will come off before it significantly alters the equation. If I’m wrong and we get a prolonged pac ridge -pna eastern torch I will officially cancel winter forever and find a new hobby. 

We had the pattern in 65-66. It was because of a +3SD -NAO that we ended up cold. And that's a pattern that seems to be phasing out lately (-NAO driven cold). I am somewhat worried about the correlation we have had since 2019, and 2013, of -NAO with -pna/+epo, but it's possible that we could do better, yes. The roll forward stuff gives us a 65/35 chance of seeing some kind of moderation in January, but if not, great

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3 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

 

If we had a positive AO or a Nina I’d share your worry. He means a week later that pac ridge would be trouble. But in a Nino with -AO and split flow it’s not the same. We discussed this yesterday. And the ridge is temporary.  In a strong Nino no way we get a prolonged Nina pacific long wave pattern. It’s a response to the mjo in the MC. It will come off before it significantly alters the equation. If I’m wrong and we get a prolonged pac ridge -pna eastern torch I will officially cancel winter forever and find a new hobby. 

Again? :damage:

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26 minutes ago, CAPE said:

Latest Euro weeklies for the week beyond the end of the 0z EPS run.

Dunno about an 'Aleutian island' ridge, but I like that amped EPO ridge in conjunction with a -NAO.  Not one word about -PNA. There is no big trough there and a slightly -PNA can actually be our friend in a Nino- think shortwaves ejecting eastward taking the southern route under a NA block. It is likely going to be a temporary feature in this case.

1705017600-GiCuMKSOxkE.png

then we get to the KU Feb pattern lmao

ecmwf-weeklies-avg-nhemi-z500_anom_7day-7091200.thumb.png.04e5a34343252456a56d8b300b564046.png

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6 minutes ago, Stormchaserchuck1 said:

We had the pattern in 65-66. It was because of a +3SD -NAO that we ended up cold. And that's a pattern that seems to be phasing out lately (-NAO driven cold). I am somewhat worried about the correlation we have had since 2019, and 2013, of -NAO with -pna/+epo, but it's possible that we could do better, yes. The roll forward stuff gives us a 65/35 chance of seeing some kind of moderation in January, but if not, great

If a -nao doesn’t work then we’re essentially F’d during any -pdo cycle (which can last 20+ years) because the only way we overcame a hostile pac base state in past -pdos was blocking except for random one off fluke luck with progressive waves. But that’s not a path to a snowy winter just a once in a while fluke reprieve. 

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5 minutes ago, psuhoffman said:

But you know better?

The Stratosphere warming, which is the favored pattern, seems projected to happen. Every Stratosphere warming since March 2018 though has become a -NAO just as we had -PNA develop at the same time. Say that ENSO is different this year, and that is somewhat true, but don't give it too much weight: We are not posting a monster N. Pacific low so far like '82, '97, '15.. the event continues to act weak/moderate

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7 minutes ago, Stormchaserchuck1 said:

The Stratosphere warming, which is the favored pattern, seems projected to happen. Every Stratosphere warming since March 2018 though has become a -NAO just as we had -PNA develop at the same time. Say that ENSO is different this year, and that is somewhat true, but don't give it too much weight: We are not posting a monster N. Pacific low so far like '82, '97, '15.. the event continues to act weak/moderate

Ok let’s come at this a different way. What exactly would you want to see to say “it’s gonna be cold/snowy”? 

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