Spring Banter Thread

[NJwx85]

6 minutes ago, IrishRob17 said:

Don't pay attention to qpf maps at this range, or so I've heard when they aren't juicy

I still hold this philosophy, but they are fun to look at.

[bluewave]

I got to experience 5" in just under 2 hours in June 95 and 10" in less than 12 hrs during August 2011. It would be pretty wild to get an extreme amount of rain in a minute or even 5 minutes.

https://www.wunderground.com/blog/weatherhistorian/what-is-the-most-rain-to-ever-fall-in-one-minute-or-one-hour

One-minute rainfalls

It is hard to imagine how an accurate measurement of precipitation over a 60-second period can be made. However, the U.S. Weather Bureau conducted several exhaustive studies of the Unionville, Maryland claim to 1.23” in one minute on July 4, 1956 and determined it to be accurate (see for the Monthly Weather Review summary). A recording rain gauge: A Friez Universal Type with a 12-inch capacity, dual traverse pen, and 24-hour clock gear on a chart drum was used to make the measurement. It had good exposure and measured a storm total of 3.60” between 2:50 p.m and 11:30 p.m. with 2.84” of this falling in a 50-minute period between 2:50-3:40 p.m. The minute that ostensibly measured the 1.23” total occurred around 3:22-3:23 p.m. Here is a copy of the trace:

A number of experiments were made on the gauge to determine its calibration and accuracy. The gauge passed all the tests to which it was subjected. Anecdotal information also played a part in the record’s certification. Extreme flash flooding and erosion were reported in the surrounding area and the sky became so dark that residents were forced to turn lights on in spite of being mid-afternoon. Roof gutters were overwhelmed, with water reported flowing off roofs “like Niagara Falls”.

The Unionville figure is generally considered not only the U.S. record for one minute but also the world record for such. A much-quoted 1.50” at Barot, Guadeloupe on November 26, 1970 cannot be verified (in fact, there appears to be no such location on the Caribbean island).

Other significant one-minute rainfalls include 0.69” at Jefferson, Iowa on July 10, 1955 and 0.65” at Opid’s Camp, California on April 5, 1926. At Jefferson 1.00” fell in 109 seconds.

[doncat]

23 minutes ago, bluewave said:

I got to experience 5" in just under 2 hours in June 95 and 10" in less than 12 hrs during August 2011. It would be pretty wild to get an extreme amount of rain in a minute or even 5 minutes.

https://www.wunderground.com/blog/weatherhistorian/what-is-the-most-rain-to-ever-fall-in-one-minute-or-one-hour

One-minute rainfalls

It is hard to imagine how an accurate measurement of precipitation over a 60-second period can be made. However, the U.S. Weather Bureau conducted several exhaustive studies of the Unionville, Maryland claim to 1.23” in one minute on July 4, 1956 and determined it to be accurate (see for the Monthly Weather Review summary). A recording rain gauge: A Friez Universal Type with a 12-inch capacity, dual traverse pen, and 24-hour clock gear on a chart drum was used to make the measurement. It had good exposure and measured a storm total of 3.60” between 2:50 p.m and 11:30 p.m. with 2.84” of this falling in a 50-minute period between 2:50-3:40 p.m. The minute that ostensibly measured the 1.23” total occurred around 3:22-3:23 p.m. Here is a copy of the trace:

A number of experiments were made on the gauge to determine its calibration and accuracy. The gauge passed all the tests to which it was subjected. Anecdotal information also played a part in the record’s certification. Extreme flash flooding and erosion were reported in the surrounding area and the sky became so dark that residents were forced to turn lights on in spite of being mid-afternoon. Roof gutters were overwhelmed, with water reported flowing off roofs “like Niagara Falls”.

The Unionville figure is generally considered not only the U.S. record for one minute but also the world record for such. A much-quoted 1.50” at Barot, Guadeloupe on November 26, 1970 cannot be verified (in fact, there appears to be no such location on the Caribbean island).

Other significant one-minute rainfalls include 0.69” at Jefferson, Iowa on July 10, 1955 and 0.65” at Opid’s Camp, California on April 5, 1926. At Jefferson 1.00” fell in 109 seconds.

I've often wondered about some of those one minute etc. rain records...just doesn't seem possible to me to get so much in such a short period of time...The most rain I can remember getting in a short period of time is maybe 0.50" in five minutes...that's based off memory so it could be higher.

[doncat]

Had 10.85" of rain here for the 39 day period ending May 5th.

[JerseyWx]

I think Monday will finally be the turning point.  After that, 70's and sun should return (and hopefully stay).

[NJwx85]

40 minutes ago, JerseyWx said:

I think Monday will finally be the turning point.  After that, 70's and sun should return (and hopefully stay).

Well it looks like we change to a warmer but but not necessarily drier pattern.

[JerseyWx]

48 minutes ago, NJwx85 said:

Well it looks like we change to a warmer but but not necessarily drier pattern.

True, the warmth is what I'm looking forward to.  It just hasn't felt like May these last couple of weeks.

[winterwarlock]

The average is only around 70..low 70s..ive been in the mid 60s this week...its not that abnormal. ..not supposed to be 80 in April and May

[NJwx85]

12 minutes ago, winterwarlock said:

The average is only around 70..low 70s..ive been in the mid 60s this week...its not that abnormal. ..not supposed to be 80 in April and May

It ended up being sunnier than initially thought which helped to warm things up. It's still amazing that with full sunshine in early May we only managed low to mid 60's most days. I think people also expect to go straight from 50 to 85 because that's been the case more times than not recently. 

You're going to be happy this time next week with a shot at 80's next Thursday and Friday before things cool off again going into the weekend.

[gravitylover]

Re: Excessive short term rainfall rates -

Twice I've been through what I would consider outrageous rainfall, once in the summer of 1989 in Cordova AK we got 11" in just a few hours.  We went outside during the heaviest period and couldn't see more than a few feet.  Afterwards the streets were like raging rivers and the ones that fed off the mt above town were uncrossable.  There were ropes anchored to the buildings on either side of the others so you could hold on while you made your way across.  It took several hours for the runoff to finally make its way to the ocean.  

Then there was hurricane (TS?) Floyd in Sept 1999.  Here in Putnam County we got upwards of 14" of rain with nearly all of that falling in just a few hours in the afternoon.  I was in the car and at one point couldn't see past the windshield, not past the end of the hood past the end of the dashboard!  Driving along and it looked like I was heading into a wall so I slowed down to about 10mph and aimed the right side mirror at the ground so I could see the edge of the pavement.  All of a sudden whoosh, nothing   and the noise, the noise...  I rolled off the edge of the road and sat there for about 5 minutes until I could see past the end of the hood again.  There were cars scattered off the sides of the road that tried to drive through it and lost, the sheer volume of moving water on the road and running across it was staggering.  

[NJwx85]

The heaviest rain I ever experienced was during Hurricane Irene. Recorded 12.5" of rain in just over 10 hours.

[NJwx85]

13 minutes ago, gravitylover said:

Re: Excessive short term rainfall rates -

Twice I've been through what I would consider outrageous rainfall, once in the summer of 1989 in Cordova AK we got 11" in just a few hours.  We went outside during the heaviest period and couldn't see more than a few feet.  Afterwards the streets were like raging rivers and the ones that fed off the mt above town were uncrossable.  There were ropes anchored to the buildings on either side of the others so you could hold on while you made your way across.  It took several hours for the runoff to finally make its way to the ocean.  

Then there was hurricane (TS?) Floyd in Sept 1999.  Here in Putnam County we got upwards of 14" of rain with nearly all of that falling in just a few hours in the afternoon.  I was in the car and at one point couldn't see past the windshield, not past the end of the hood past the end of the dashboard!  Driving along and it looked like I was heading into a wall so I slowed down to about 10mph and aimed the right side mirror at the ground so I could see the edge of the pavement.  All of a sudden whoosh, nothing   and the noise, the noise...  I rolled off the edge of the road and sat there for about 5 minutes until I could see past the end of the hood again.  There were cars scattered off the sides of the road that tried to drive through it and lost, the sheer volume of moving water on the road and running across it was staggering.  

Floyd was actually a major hurricane at one point and then I believe cat 2 when it made landfall in North Carolina. Then the system merged with a frontal boundary and rode up the coast as a tropical storm. I'm not exactly sure how much rain we received, but we had been in a drought and the rain came down so heavily that the river reached major flood stage the next day.

I also remember that a hornets nest about the size of a basketball was hanging in a tree across the street and after the storm 90% of it was gone.

[bluewave]

19 hours ago, doncat said:

I've often wondered about some of those one minute etc. rain records...just doesn't seem possible to me to get so much in such a short period of time...The most rain I can remember getting in a short period of time is maybe 0.50" in five minutes...that's based off memory so it could be higher.

The best we were able to do around our area was 1.08" in 9 minutes during August 2014.

 

 

 

[NJwx85]

[NJwx85]

1 minute ago, bluewave said:

The best we were able to do around our area was 1.08" in 9 minutes during August 2014.

 

 

 

I had one thunderstorm that more or less stalled over my house sometime last year I believe when I received over 3" of rain in about 40 minutes.

[bluewave]

25 minutes ago, NJwx85 said:

I had one thunderstorm that more or less stalled over my house sometime last year I believe when I received over 3" of rain in about 40 minutes.

My under 2 hr record record is 5.15" in about 90-115 minutes on 6-22-95.

[doncat]

7 minutes ago, bluewave said:

My under 2 hr record record is 5.15" in about 90-115 minutes in June 1995.

For a 30 day period, had 25.30" here from 8/8 - 9/8 , 2011.

[bluewave]

13 minutes ago, doncat said:

For a 30 day period, had 25.30" here from 8/8 - 9/8 , 2011.

The summer of 2011 was probably the most extreme we ever saw around the area.

 

Earliest 100 of year at Newark in June

Highest temperature ever at Newark in July at 108

First baseball sized damaging hailstorm around the Queens/Nassau line to start August

My heaviest rainfall in under 12 hours in Long Beach in mid-August of 10"

Irene near the end of the month

[JerseyWx]

2 hours ago, winterwarlock said:

The average is only around 70..low 70s..ive been in the mid 60s this week...its not that abnormal. ..not supposed to be 80 in April and May

Maybe down by you things are different, but It's been very abnormal here.  I've had 30's multiple mornings this month, including today.  Since last Friday, everyday has been in the 50's with the exception of two, and those barely topped 60°.

[nzucker]

3 hours ago, gravitylover said:

Re: Excessive short term rainfall rates -

Twice I've been through what I would consider outrageous rainfall, once in the summer of 1989 in Cordova AK we got 11" in just a few hours.  We went outside during the heaviest period and couldn't see more than a few feet.  Afterwards the streets were like raging rivers and the ones that fed off the mt above town were uncrossable.  There were ropes anchored to the buildings on either side of the others so you could hold on while you made your way across.  It took several hours for the runoff to finally make its way to the ocean.  

Then there was hurricane (TS?) Floyd in Sept 1999.  Here in Putnam County we got upwards of 14" of rain with nearly all of that falling in just a few hours in the afternoon.  I was in the car and at one point couldn't see past the windshield, not past the end of the hood past the end of the dashboard!  Driving along and it looked like I was heading into a wall so I slowed down to about 10mph and aimed the right side mirror at the ground so I could see the edge of the pavement.  All of a sudden whoosh, nothing   and the noise, the noise...  I rolled off the edge of the road and sat there for about 5 minutes until I could see past the end of the hood again.  There were cars scattered off the sides of the road that tried to drive through it and lost, the sheer volume of moving water on the road and running across it was staggering.  

You had a lot more in Hurricane Floyd than we did in Dobbs Ferry...I think about 7" fell in Southern Westchester. I do remember school being delayed the following morning, only time we had a delay for rain.

[nzucker]

1 hour ago, JerseyWx said:

Maybe down by you things are different, but It's been very abnormal here.  I've had 30's multiple mornings this month, including today.  Since last Friday, everyday has been in the 50's with the exception of two, and those barely topped 60°.

Saturday is forecast at 53/47 here, which should be close to -10F departure. Not often you see highs in the low 50s in mid-May. I do remember a high of 46F on 5/14/10 in Westchester, that was one of the latest times we've used the heat.

[JerseyWx]

33 minutes ago, nzucker said:

Saturday is forecast at 53/47 here, which should be close to -10F departure. Not often you see highs in the low 50s in mid-May. I do remember a high of 46F on 5/14/10 in Westchester, that was one of the latest times we've used the heat.

I agree, and it's especially rare seeing 50's this consistently.  Saturday should be a pretty big BN day, and then we slowly start climbing back to May like weather.

[NJwx85]

It's amazing to see that wall of water on radar moving almost due NW to SE, although clearly it's made some Eastward progress because DC wasn't even supposed to be in the rain and it's almost too far SW now.

[NJwx85]

Well if this storm ends up as a bust at least the GFS keeps up hope that we won't flip back to a painfully boring Summer pattern. Storm rides right up the coast.

[gravitylover]

5 hours ago, nzucker said:

You had a lot more in Hurricane Floyd than we did in Dobbs Ferry...I think about 7" fell in Southern Westchester. I do remember school being delayed the following morning, only time we had a delay for rain.

Yeah the totals were really amazing.  I wasn't the least bit surprised to see the 15+ at Fahnestock St Park considering so many of the home stations nearly 1k feet below that were at 13-14".  The amount of stuff that was moved around in the woods was inspiring.  One hill that we rode regularly was pretty much just a growing in old work road and after the storm it had lost nearly four feet of topsoil and was washed out right down to bedrock.  A little east of there in a tight spot in a canyon you could see where the water level was 15 feet up the sides on the tight corners and the sheer number of huge old trees that got washed down was incredible.  18 years later and there is still evidence of it if you know what to look for and where to look for it.

[Cfa]

Heaviest rain I've experienced was that August 2014 event when I lived in Suffolk, I was near the bullseye. The rain was pretty loud, you could hardly hear much else, but it was soothing. But never did I expect it to amount to over a foot in 2-3 hours, it was surreal. Would've been the perfect time to have a digital rain gauge set up.

[dmillz25]

I would say Irene was the heaviest rain I've experienced. over 8" in 12 hrs. Last Fridays rates was one of the heaviest I've experienced as well

[Stormlover74]

4 hours ago, dmillz25 said:

I would say Irene was the heaviest rain I've experienced. over 8" in 12 hrs. Last Fridays rates was one of the heaviest I've experienced as well

I think Floyd was better at least for central/interior NJ. Many places saw a foot in a fairly short period of time

367 mm looks like the max which is like 14-15"

 

[dmillz25]

1 hour ago, Stormlover74 said:

I think Floyd was better at least for central/interior NJ. Many places saw a foot in a fairly short period of time

367 mm looks like the max which is like 14-15"

 

I Vaguely remember Floyd but I do remember it raining heavily for a long time

[Stormlover74]

2 minutes ago, dmillz25 said:

I Vaguely remember Floyd but I do remember it raining heavily for a long time

The bulk fell in 12 to 15 hours. There were times it would quit and then we'd get torrential downpours. It did that all day long but with much less wind than expected.