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Possible strong/super El Niño forming?


snowman19

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not every el nino is wet around here during the winter...1991-92 is example and there was below average snowfall...even 1982-83 had below the normal el nino winter precipitation... 1994-95 and 2006-07 were dry with little snow...two cold winters 1963-64 and 1968-69 had near to above average snowfall with big snows...65-66 and 87-88 had below average snowfall also...if it's dry it better be cold...

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not every el nino is wet around here during the winter...1991-92 is example and there was below average snowfall...even 1982-83 had below the normal el nino winter precipitation... 1994-95 and 2006-07 were dry with little snow...two cold winters 1963-64 and 1968-69 had near to above average snowfall with big snows...65-66 and 87-88 had below average snowfall also...if it's dry it better be cold...

I wouldn't worry too much about 1991-92.

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The JMA has a fairly classic strong El Nino progression with a cooler October followed by a warm November in the Northeast. Retrogession of the mid level ridge into the West for October with an Aleutian low, then a shift eastward in the mean features for November. December initiates the retrogression process once again, at least as per the JMA.

 

 

October:

 

oqbps3.png

 

 

 

November:

 

msljcx.png

 

 

December:

 

29bxwy.png

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The Euro builds a massive vortex into Alaska and screaming Pacific Jet into the West by Day 10. If that's true the PDO's taking a beating. 

 

And with the Nino the way it is, it's only a matter of time before the charged STJ slams the Southwest. It would also likely restart the cool/wet pattern here in Texas which disappeared after mid-June. 

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The Euro builds a massive vortex into Alaska and screaming Pacific Jet into the West by Day 10. If that's true the PDO's taking a beating.

And with the Nino the way it is, it's only a matter of time before the charged STJ slams the Southwest. It would also likely restart the cool/wet pattern here in Texas which disappeared after mid-June.

The Euro says ready, set, go for Super El Niño 2015-2016 starting real soon if it's correct...
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The amount of continuing westward shift of the warmest SST's will be the key to the winter

forecast. It's what models like the Euro, SST CA, and others have been indicating by

showing primary forcing shifting to Nino 4 during the winter.

 

https://twitter.com/KellyHereid/status/641982626342019072

 

attachicon.gifScreen shot 2015-09-11 at 9.00.31 AM.png

 

attachicon.gifScreen shot 2015-09-11 at 9.00.36 AM.png

 

 

Before some read  Modoki and jump on and start screaming , WSI does not mean SST style Modoki , they mean in terms

of similar forcing in Modoki years  .

 

Yes the 1.2 and 4 region are not " below " normal , actually they are very much the opposite . However the greatest warm departures are west 120 and the guidance keeps expanding this west as we get towards DEC .

 

So as long as you are not forcing out of the 1.2 region and instead back towards the dateline along  with the guidance allowing a deep NEG S of the Aleutians ,once past DEC  IMO ,  you could pull ridge back and that will open the door for HP to slip through the lakes towards the base of the trough in the means in the SE. 

 

This is what many here have been opining on since July, at least the guidance has come to our way of thinking . 

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This is exactly why myself, and many others, are touting a reasonably snowy and cold winter.

The EURO did what we thought it would.....as for the AO/NAO...that was expected, too.

I wouldn't expect much help from the NAO for the foreseeable future. I'm sure some winters will average negative but I think much like the 80s into the early 90s we will be predominantly positive during winter for the next 10 plus years if you believe the Atlantic phase change, and I do.

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As anticipated, recent CFS V2 runs have been trending quite a bit weaker with the maximum intensity of this El Nino event, now depicting a peak region 3.4 value around 2.0c. I still feel confident in my original call for a trimonthly ONI of 1.7 - 1.95c in region 3.4.

 

 

nino34Sea.gif

Yea, we've been in agreement on that.

 

Still feel great about my 1.8 from July.

 

Not a record breaker, but an impressive warm ENSO, nonetheless...

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The amount of continuing westward shift of the warmest SST's will be the key to the winter

forecast. It's what models like the Euro, SST CA, and others have been indicating by

showing primary forcing shifting to Nino 4 during the winter.

 

https://twitter.com/KellyHereid/status/641982626342019072

 

attachicon.gifScreen shot 2015-09-11 at 9.00.31 AM.png

 

attachicon.gifScreen shot 2015-09-11 at 9.00.36 AM.png

I'm going out on a limb and guessing that snowman, nor clichevortex will quote this bad boy.... god love 'em both. :lol:

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I wouldn't expect much help from the NAO for the foreseeable future. I'm sure some winters will average negative but I think much like the 80s into the early 90s we will be predominantly positive during winter for the next 10 plus years if you believe the Atlantic phase change, and I do.

 

 

I disagree. Which phase change are you referring to, the AMO? The correlation between it and the NAO is very weak overall. The NAO decadal cycle has generally been on a downward slope over the past several years. Beyond that, variations in solar forcing modulate the behavior of the NAO via changes in ozone chemistry in the stratosphere, as numerous studies in the scientific literature have shown. The declining solar constant overall should increase the propensity for high latitude blocking in the NATL; not every year, but I expect an increased frequency of anomalous and stagnant blocking patterns over the next decade.

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I disagree. Which phase change are you referring to, the AMO? The correlation between it and the NAO is very weak overall. The NAO decadal cycle has generally been on a downward slope over the past several years. Beyond that, variations in solar forcing modulate the behavior of the NAO via changes in ozone chemistry in the stratosphere, as numerous studies in the scientific literature have shown. The declining solar constant overall should increase the propensity for high latitude blocking in the NATL; not every year, but I expect an increased frequency of anomalous and stagnant blocking patterns over the next decade.

I was going to say something to the effect of "don't these cycles  last closer to 15-20 years"....but didn't feel weel enough versed on the issue to counter.

 

I thought we had several years left, too.....but god only knows when the hammer drops.

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I'm going out on a limb and guessing that snowman, nor clichevortex will quote this bad boy.... god love 'em both. :lol:

I've already seen that... was posted on Accuweather's forum a while ago. I don't have anything to say to that (neither rebuttal nor support) because it's way over my head. I'll believe the big westward shift when I see it. It's been teasing us too long.

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I've already seen that... was posted on Accuweather's forum a while ago. I don't have anything to say to that (neither rebuttal nor support) because it's way over my head. I'll believe the big westward shift when I see it. It's been teasing us too long.

I don't know much about the intricacies of meteorology that dictate ENSO fluctuations...you know more than I do.

 

I just know east-based sucks lol

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I wouldn't expect much help from the NAO for the foreseeable future. I'm sure some winters will average negative but I think much like the 80s into the early 90s we will be predominantly positive during winter for the next 10 plus years if you believe the Atlantic phase change, and I do.

since the 1980's the nao has averaged below 1.00 for Jan once since 1987 and that was in 2010...Since 1986 the nao has averaged below -1.00 once and that was in 2010 also...the 1960's had many Jan/Feb months with a -1.00 or below nao number...It looks like we have been in a positive cycle of the winter nao since the 1970's...

http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/pna/norm.nao.monthly.b5001.current.ascii.table

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