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December Forecast Discussion


REDMK6GLI

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The OP Euro actually has +16 to +20C 850's pushing into the Plains so the big story will be record

warmth mid-month. Can you say pattern change? This will be one of the most dramatic November

into December warm ups on record for the Plains to the Midwest. But at least we won't have to

hear that polar vortex meme anymore. :P

 

https://twitter.com/StuOstro/status/539593330326134784

If that warmth heads east and I'm sure it will even in muted form, the weenie suicides here are going to be out of control

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He keeps saying the same thing over and over again. He should just be patient.

I wasn't even trying to start anything it was a legit question. There's a pretty good consensus now that mid December is going to mild to perhaps very mild so I was asking if changes would take place later on which would take us toward late December.

Again if it's warm beyond then so be it I'll accept it its weather what can you do.

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I wasn't even trying to start anything it was a legit question. There's a pretty good consensus now that mid December is going to mild to perhaps very mild so I was asking if changes would take place later on which would take us toward late December.

Again if it's warm beyond then so be it I'll accept it its weather what can you do.

Nothing right now supports very mild which pretty much means a torch, above normal at best. Warm ups have been muted as they've gotten closer. Also 15-20th look like the time period where we will start seeing more promising changes over greenland, AK and the NP
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If that warmth heads east and I'm sure it will even in muted form, the weenie suicides here are going to be out of control

To that extreme It doesn`t . The Euro ensembles have no SE ridge the flow day 10 - 15 is from the W then NW . There is no SW flow .

Warmest 850`s are plus 5 day 12 - and by that Canada is cooling and we are back near 0 at 850  by 360  .

 

What`s a 2 -3 SD above normal in MANITOBA is close to normal at KNYC when the highs are in the mid 40`s . 

The air though Pacific does not modify all that much as the flow is due E . There is plenty of snow cover at this time in Canada so our departures do not explode .  Prob A   . Day 1 -10 were suppose to be A but  they will turn out N . 

Careful in the LR this stuff turns on a dime, the Spray is wide so the models tend to wash out .

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Ok fair enough. I'm actually hoping we do see such an epic warm up in the long range from the Euro and Gfs. The anomalies are off the charts especially in parts of the plains. I love extremes so this would be a great study.

So far the gfs is consistent in showing the big warm up post 12/12 so it'll be interesting to see if it plays out that way and also how warm things get if it does occur.

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Ok fair enough. I'm actually hoping we do see such an epic warm up in the long range from the Euro and Gfs. The anomalies are off the charts especially in parts of the plains. I love extremes so this would be a great study.

So far the gfs is consistent in showing the big warm up post 12/12 so it'll be interesting to see if it plays out that way and also how warm things get if it does occur.

It shows 40s..that's not a big warm up

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Ok fair enough. I'm actually hoping we do see such an epic warm up in the long range from the Euro and Gfs. The anomalies are off the charts especially in parts of the plains. I love extremes so this would be a great study.

So far the gfs is consistent in showing the big warm up post 12/12 so it'll be interesting to see if it plays out that way and also how warm things get if it does occur.

These are the surfaces at 240  . EPIC ?   

 

They are above there N s  but I think epic does not apply 

post-7472-0-29439000-1417627728_thumb.pn

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Ok fair enough. I'm actually hoping we do see such an epic warm up in the long range from the Euro and Gfs. The anomalies are off the charts especially in parts of the plains. I love extremes so this would be a great study.

So far the gfs is consistent in showing the big warm up post 12/12 so it'll be interesting to see if it plays out that way and also how warm things get if it does occur.

 

 

The GFS is largely violating its MJO forecast with its depictions, IMO either the MJO forecast is wrong or the pattern it seems to indicate we'll be in is wrong because even if we only go to phase 7 thats an abnormally mild pattern for phase 7.

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It shows 40s..that's not a big warm up

It would be a lot warmer than that 850s are spiking above +10 over our area on the gfs and thats a widespread almost summer like over the top ridge spanning across the CONUS.

We'll see what the Euro does as it managed to hold off the warmth around here due to those lows.

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The GFS is largely violating its MJO forecast with its depictions, IMO either the MJO forecast is wrong or the pattern it seems to indicate we'll be in is wrong because even if we only go to phase 7 thats an abnormally mild pattern for phase 7.

Well apparently the gfs now brings the MJO to the COD after a brief passage through phase 7 so it's starting to come more in line with what may unfold. We've seen mild Decembers in Ninos before but this upcoming pattern resembles more of a strong Nino than a weak to moderate one.

Again this is based off the current forecast as the models could very well be overdoing the LR warmth.

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Well apparently the gfs now brings the MJO to the COD after a brief passage through phase 7 so it's starting to come more in line with what may unfold. We've seen mild Decembers in Ninos before but this upcoming pattern resembles more of a strong Nino than a weak to moderate one.

Again this is based off the current forecast as the models could very well be overdoing the LR warmth.

The operational GFS has been doing that now for 2-3 days, the ensembles are not though. 

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EURO and GFS >> UKMET

Euro the number 1 skill score model below takes the MJO into 7 - 3 days ago it killed it in 6 .

 

The UKMET the number 2 skill score model takes through 7 with more amplitude and has not corrected .

 

 

The GFS ?  really , my sides are hurting . Please stop . 

post-7472-0-93664900-1417628537_thumb.gi

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i used to respect your posts but slowly your losing my respect. You've got to look at 3-5 days max. Watch that heat get shunted down, it's been happening the last 8 months

That's record warmth in the Midwest...even if it's muted it will still be warm! I don't know what you want me to say? That warmth will get to us at some point, we can only avoid it for so long. I would love to see some cold start building in Canada on these op runs. Next week threats looks meh for the coast. No cold air mass to tap over the conus.

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Interesting map on the SNE about MJO 7 in a positive Nino state. Looks very different from a typical phase 7 in December and is very similar to the pattern we may resemble.

 

I was literally going over there to ask some of those guys if they knew if phase 7 and 8 during Ninos in December were warmer than Jan and Feb and then I saw that posted.

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By far one of the worst pages of discussion in this thread thus far. It is an utter train wreck of a discussion with almost no backing of science and hugging of a GFS/EURO LR model depiction? We need earthlight to come in here do some house cleaning before all credibility in this sub forum is lost.

Let me remind all you winter canceller's that most of the mets on this forum arent concerned and the ones that are, they are trying to find any model data no matter how far in advance to justify they're means. El Nino= backloaded winter and december being the worst month of them all historically.

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I was literally going over there to ask some of those guys if they knew if phase 7 and 8 during Ninos in December were warmer than Jan and Feb and then I saw that posted.

Yeh I just saw that  .Question maybe Tom or Chris could pull it . What do the 2 Meters look like with 500 set up . 

SE trough doesn`t make me think the EC as warm as the rest of the CONUS  . 

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Jesus Christ. Yup let's cancel winter on Dec 3rd bc the long range pattern doesn't look good. Read what the Mets and good posters are saying about EL Ninos and back loaded winters. Be patient or stop posting....this goes for everyone.

+1   at least the roads will be fine for travel so the doom's day weenies can go out and buy their razor blades.  ;) 

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