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December 19 - 21 Storm System


IWXwx

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I never start threads, and certainly not storm threads. However, we need something to mix things up here in the MW/OV, so here it goes. As BI and others have mentioned, the current pattern is giving the models fits in the mid-range.

IWX puts it succinctly in describing the forecast challenge for this next weather-maker:

00Z ECMWF SUGGESTS THIS LOW

WILL TAKE A MUCH MORE NWLY TRACK THAN PREVIOUS RUN... PUTTING OUR

CWA WELL INTO THE WARM SECTOR WITH BULK OF PRECIP IN OUR AREA

FALLING AS RAIN...PSBLY ENDING AS SW-. 00Z GFS MAINTAINS THE

CIRCULATION LONGER THAN ITS PREVIOUS RUNS WITH CONSIDERABLY SLOWER

MOVEMENT AND MORE SELY TRACK THAN THE ECMWF. THIS SOLUTION SUGGESTS

BULK OF PRECIP IN OUR CWA WOULD BE SNOW....FALLING MAINLY ACROSS THE

SE 1/2. GEFS SPAGHETTI PLOTS SUGGEST BOTH THE OPERATIONAL GFS/ECMWF

SCENARIOS PSBL. CONSIDERING MODEL BIASES... EXPECT A SLOWER MOVG

SYSTEM THAN THE ECMWF WITH A MORE NWLY TRACK THAN GFS WILL BE THE

FINAL SOLUTION. GOING CHC OF RN/SN MON-TUE STILL APPEARS TO BE THE

BEST FCST ATTM.

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Godspeed IWXwx. But I always liked the warmer GFS solution. I became a little quizzical when it shifted towards the other globals yesterday, but now that the GGEM and EURO have trended NW, I'm more confident warm is the right way to go.

It sucks but the models are going to play with our hearts trying to change the pattern too quickly. I still see the "light at the end of the tunnel" but it's going to be after Christmas imho.

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Godspeed IWXwx. But I always liked the warmer GFS solution. I became a little quizzical when it shifted towards the other globals yesterday, but now that the GGEM and EURO have trended NW, I'm more confident warm is the right way to go.

It sucks but the models are going to play with our hearts trying to change the pattern too quickly. I still see the "light at the end of the tunnel" but it's going to be after Christmas imho.

Its called the winter of 2012/2013

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rolleyes.gif I dont think so. Winter hasnt even officially started lol. My how spoiled weve become these past several years laugh.png

yeah i don't understand all the panicking and complaining. I grew up in Lima OH where most winters didn't get going until after Christmas. And this looks to definitely be the case this December. Hopefully January thru March delivers. Spoiled for sure.

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I totally get the it's early talk and 1 storm oftem makes or breaks a season but lets not play the winter hasn't technically started card yet...given sun angle and climo, December is and will continue to be a major part of the regions snow season and a near record slow start does not bode well for the season.

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I totally get the it's early talk and 1 storm oftem makes or breaks a season but lets not play the winter hasn't technically started card yet...given sun angle and climo, December is and will continue to be a major part of the regions snow season and a near record slow start does not bode well for the season.

Also add in the fact that averages add in October and November snow, which many did not see.

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I totally get the it's early talk and 1 storm oftem makes or breaks a season but lets not play the winter hasn't technically started card yet...given sun angle and climo, December is and will continue to be a major part of the regions snow season and a near record slow start does not bode well for the season.

I agree with you for the along/north of I-80 crowd. South of here normally does not see much snow before Christmas. Like you said...It will just take one big storm to "catch up" regardless...

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I totally get the it's early talk and 1 storm oftem makes or breaks a season but lets not play the winter hasn't technically started card yet...given sun angle and climo, December is and will continue to be a major part of the regions snow season and a near record slow start does not bode well for the season.

Agreed. We are looking at a massive hunk of the midwest that is running below normal, not just a few isolated areas. Too many people on this board are IMBY and don't realize just how many snowstorms it will take for the region as a whole to break close to even. Look at the snowfall deficits that have built up in the northern midwest. Its going to take an incredible pattern that rocks Duluth as equally hard as Indianapolis. Otherwise, its a safe bet that several sites in the midwest will be below average come April, just a matter of where at this point.

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with the 0z 850 line already near Chicago, screw this pattern.

I'm sure you're leaning toward the GEM and Euro's Upper Midwest storm idea, right? At least those areas could use some snow as well, along with pretty much everyone but the Interior Northeast (who surprisingly have squeaked out a couple great storms in 2011-12.

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I'm sure you're leaning toward the GEM and Euro's Upper Midwest storm idea, right? At least those areas could use some snow as well, along with pretty much everyone but the Interior Northeast (who surprisingly have squeaked out a couple great storms in 2011-12.

there is no cold air and will be no widespread snows for anyone with this system.

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Even in N Wisconsin and Minnesota? I wouldn't give up on their chances so fast if something close to the Euro or GEM verifies.

yep, even those places, at least nothing widespread, outside the west texas high pains area, this one is DOA, the 200-300 mb maps are total junk, major cold air issues and it's not like it's lurking just north.

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rolleyes.gif I dont think so. Winter hasnt even officially started lol. My how spoiled weve become these past several years laugh.png

Not being spoiled being objective. I have stated this month were over due for a lack luster kind of winter I fine with that. A lot of this winter is gone. Places like Cleveland and Chicago haven't even had an Inch of snow! Gaylord 9.8" really? they average 109" a season. They will be lucky to hit 60-70 inches this season. I guarantee you that 70-75% of the Midwest will finish below average on snowfall and there's no guarantee if the cold/frigid air gets locked into the MW in Jan, that there will be a favorable track... Usually benefits the lower Ohio Valley and the NE. BTW: This winter starts dec 21st is all crap for the MW. You know very well that the north woods winter starts after Halloween and along I-80 its around Thanksgiving points after. Luckily places like Detroit and Lansing have done decent to this point. We have a better chance at hitting average this season but a lot of places...WOW what a bad start yikes.png.

BTW: Winnipeg and Edmonton no snow depth... thats nuts

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Not being spoiled being objective. I have stated this month were over due for a lack luster kind of winter I fine with that. A lot of this winter is gone. Places like Cleveland and Chicago haven't even had an Inch of snow! Gaylord 9.8" really? they average 109" a season. They will be lucky to hit 60-70 inches this season. I guarantee you that 70-75% of the Midwest will finish below average on snowfall and there's no guarantee if the cold/frigid air gets locked into the MW in Jan, that there will be a favorable track... Usually benefits the lower Ohio Valley and the NE. BTW: This winter starts dec 21st is all crap for the MW. You know very well that the north woods winter starts after Halloween and along I-80 its around Thanksgiving points after. Luckily places like Detroit and Lansing have done decent to this point. We have a better chance at hitting average this season but a lot of places...WOW what a bad start yikes.png.

BTW: Winnipeg and Edmonton no snow depth... thats nuts

Yeah I agree, people say winter hasn't started yet but snow season sure should have started by now. The northwoods up here are off to a horrible start and even if we have average snow after today it will still be way down.

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Yeah I agree, people say winter hasn't started yet but snow season sure should have started by now. The northwoods up here are off to a horrible start and even if we have average snow after today it will still be way down.

Meteorological Winter starts December 1st. Also the coldest day (on average) around here is January 21st. Assuming each season gets 3 months (90 days), and winter is centered around the coldest day, you get a range of Dec 7 to March 6.

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