2014-15 Total New England Snow Table

[Ginx snewx]

That's probably the best analog year to what he was describing.... lots of ups and downs on the snow plot, but eventually the shear quantity of snow will over-whelm the thaws.  Big snow years with thaws should still give plenty of positive snow accumulation.  Given what "above normal" snow here means, 350"+ at the peaks, even thaws won't be able to keep up with squashing that.  Though you can tell where the January thaw is on this:

 

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ice

[powderfreak]

ice

I see lots of powder days

[Ginx snewx]

I see lots of powder days

It was that but lots of icy skiing days that winter. I think it snowed 43 times that winter over 1 inches, in fact in between Nov 1 and May 1 23% of the days had over 1" of snow recorded. The thaw freeze cycle was pretty bad, there was a lack of huge powder days if I remember, more persistent snow

[powderfreak]

It was that but lots of icy skiing days that winter. I think it snowed 43 times that winter over 1 inches, in fact in between Nov 1 and May 1 23% of the days had over 1" of snow recorded. The thaw freeze cycle was pretty bad, there was a lack of huge powder days if I remember, more persistent snow

 

Well lack of huge powder days with more persistent snow doesn't really show up in the records... I just went back and looked at days where 6" or higher was recorded in a 24-hour period.  Last winter only counted 4 at the Co-Op.

 

11/27/14...7.5"

12/10/14...17"

1/19/15...9.5"

4/4/15...7.0"

*Granted this is with their issues of collecting and prone to timing differences in storms related to the 4pm measuring time.

 

In the 1995-1996 winter, there were 16 days of 6"+ reported.  So if last winter was a nickel and dime winter, then '95-96 certainly wasn't.   That's four-times more than last winter.  If I drop it back to 5.5"+, there were 20 such days in 1995-1996 verses 6 days last winter. 

 

That winter blows anything recently away in terms of number of 6"+ snowfalls.  But one could see that in the annual snowfall... last winter's Co-Op tally was 164" and '95-96 was 309".  On a snow board (vs. an elevated bucket) that would've been a 400" winter.

[powderfreak]

What in the world happened in April of 1996?  MMNV1 recorded 60.5" in 10 days between April 8 and April 18.  Knowing they are usually low in sampling snowfall, that's pretty damn impressive to me.  Must've been heaven at the ski area...no tourists and just tons of powder for two weeks.

[ORH_wxman]

What in the world happened in April of 1996?  MMNV1 recorded 60.5" in 10 days between April 8 and April 18.  Knowing they are usually low in sampling snowfall, that's pretty damn impressive to me.

 

That was a pattern dominated by cold ULLs and some storms. They probably cleaned up in some upslope from that pattern. The beginning part of that period is the huge SNE snowstorm that dumped like 17" in ORH and almost 20" in N Foster RI.

[powderfreak]

That was a pattern dominated by cold ULLs and some storms. They probably cleaned up in some upslope from that pattern. The beginning part of that period is the huge SNE snowstorm that dumped like 17" in ORH and almost 20" in N Foster RI.

Yeah over that 10 day period it looks like they had 19" in two days at the beginning of the period (probably related to that SNE Storm?) then some light snow in the middle, then 29" around April 16-18.

[Ginx snewx]

Well lack of huge powder days with more persistent snow doesn't really show up in the records... I just went back and looked at days where 6" or higher was recorded in a 24-hour period.  Last winter only counted 4 at the Co-Op.

 

11/27/14...7.5"

12/10/14...17"

1/19/15...9.5"

4/4/15...7.0"

*Granted this is with their issues of collecting and prone to timing differences in storms related to the 4pm measuring time.

 

In the 1995-1996 winter, there were 16 days of 6"+ reported.  So if last winter was a nickel and dime winter, then '95-96 certainly wasn't.   That's four-times more than last winter.  If I drop it back to 5.5"+, there were 20 such days in 1995-1996 verses 6 days last winter. 

 

That winter blows anything recently away in terms of number of 6"+ snowfalls.  But one could see that in the annual snowfall... last winter's Co-Op tally was 164" and '95-96 was 309".  On a snow board (vs. an elevated bucket) that would've been a 400" winter.

yea like I said impressive snow year but there was a lot of ice that year in between. Skiing a lot and looking at numbers are 2 different things.

[ORH_wxman]

yea like I said impressive snow year but there was a lot of ice that year in between. Skiing a lot and looking at numbers are 2 different things.

 

 

Since he skis like 300 days per year anyway, he probably values the powder days more. Even in a cruddy winter, you'll still probably get at least 4-6 weeks combined of solid chalky packed powder skiing. In a good winter it's like 10-12 weeks combined.

 

So I could see how he would exchange some of the PP days for icy conditions if he gains 10-12 powder days in the process.

 

 

For guys like you and me, we probably prefer the solid PP conditions with lower risk of ice...esp since neither of us has a powder fetish anyway. I'll take the powder for sure, but I loath the ice too like you do.

[40/70 Benchmark]

Are we going to get a Will map?

[Ginx snewx]

Are we going to get a Will map?

haven"t had one since 

[ORH_wxman]

haven"t had one since 

 

I'm like 3-4 years behind now. I actually almost finished '12-'13, but haven't found the motivation to complete it. Then start on '13-'14 and last year, lol. I will someday.

[Ginx snewx]

Since he skis like 300 days per year anyway, he probably values the powder days more. Even in a cruddy winter, you'll still probably get at least 4-6 weeks combined of solid chalky packed powder skiing. In a good winter it's like 10-12 weeks combined.

 

So I could see how he would exchange some of the PP days for icy conditions if he gains 10-12 powder days in the process.

 

 

For guys like you and me, we probably prefer the solid PP conditions with lower risk of ice...esp since neither of us has a powder fetish anyway. I'll take the powder for sure, but I loath the ice too like you do.

Very true but in 96 for the common man there were some great days but a lot of ice days considering the epic amounts of snow is all I was saying. PF represents a small fraction of the average skier in number of days and besides in 1996 what was he like 8?

[powderfreak]

Since he skis like 300 days per year anyway, he probably values the powder days more. Even in a cruddy winter, you'll still probably get at least 4-6 weeks combined of solid chalky packed powder skiing. In a good winter it's like 10-12 weeks combined.

 

So I could see how he would exchange some of the PP days for icy conditions if he gains 10-12 powder days in the process.

 

For guys like you and me, we probably prefer the solid PP conditions with lower risk of ice...esp since neither of us has a powder fetish anyway. I'll take the powder for sure, but I loath the ice too like you do.

 

Bingo.  Also look at what I do...I measure snow.  Half the fun of that is actually measuring snow.  Getting to the mountain in the pitch black prior to 5am, checking snow boards by headlamp.  For the majority of the skiers I ski with on a daily basis (pretty much most of this town for example), if I were to take a poll I can promise you most of them would trade say 3 rainers for 12 more powder days. 

 

There's some magic about powder days that's hard to explain...the morning energy at the ski resort is almost addictive.  Plus, snowmaking and grooming equipment is so superior to what it was back in 95-96, conditions can recover in 48 hours following a rain.  Two nights of grooming and snowmaking and you can get a pack powder surface back (even if its on man-made snow). 

 

Another thing I noticed about '95-96 is that when the thaws happened (the decreases in snow depth), the depth doesn't flat-line for a while indicating a thaw followed by no new snow.  It seems to bounce right back up indicating it snowed relatively soon following a rain event.

[powderfreak]

Very true but in 96 for the common man there were some great days but a lot of ice days considering the epic amounts of snow is all I was saying. PF represents a small fraction of the average skier in number of days and besides in 1996 what was he like 8?

 

lol, I don't know how old Will is but I figure I'm only a few years younger?  I was 11 during that winter. 

 

For someone like you, yeah you want NNE to just get nickled and dimed to death all winter long with no thaws so when you book your vacation you are getting PP conditions.  For folks that live up here, I'm sure J.Spin and ADK would agree, you'll trade some consistency for picking up another dozen powder days over the course of the season. 

 

And think about it from a weenie standpoint...  say this upcoming winter would you sign up for colder departures but no single event over 6", or would you be willing to risk more volatility for a couple 18" events?  Would you trade the "shot hour" big storms for nickles and colder temps?

[Ginx snewx]

lol, I don't know how old Will is but I figure I'm only a few years younger?  I was 11 during that winter. 

 

For someone like you, yeah you want NNE to just get nickled and dimed to death all winter long with no thaws so when you book your vacation you are getting PP conditions.  For folks that live up here, I'm sure J.Spin and ADK would agree, you'll trade some consistency for picking up another dozen powder days over the course of the season. 

 

And think about it from a weenie standpoint...  say this upcoming winter would you sign up for colder departures but no single event over 6", or would you be willing to risk more volatility for a couple 18" events?  Would you trade the "shot hour" storms for nickles and colder temps?

I am about the bass no treble, give me a solid consistent winter. I loved 96 storms but the thaws sucked big time. Give me last year for a million though.This year I am all about the treble, couple of big storms and ski areas belly to belly would be perfect

[powderfreak]

I am about the bass no treble, give me a solid consistent winter. I loved 96 storms but the thaws sucked big time. Give me last year for a million though.This year I am all about the treble, couple of big storms and ski areas belly to belly would be perfect

 

Well yeah, naturally.  Big storms and two full months of big snowpack for you.

 

That's sort of like give me 2000-2001 for a million, haha.  Big snows and lack of thaw, just becoming insanity in March with 48-60" on the ground in the hill towns.

 

Pros and cons to both types of winter, I think right now I'm just itchy for a 18"+ event (last one was March 2011) after watching huge bombs drop only nickel and dime snowfall here the past few winters. 

 

Now watch we go through like 3 volatile winters but with big snowstorms alternating between rain events, and all the sudden I'm posting "you know it would be nice to have a winter month where it doesn't rain."  You want what you don't have.

[CoastalWx]

95-96 was awesome in that is was snow threats for almost 6 months.....6 months! 2002-2003 tried this too with end of October through early April as well.  Nothing will be like last year....but boy...sign me up for 4-5+ months of winter if it means a few nasty cutters. 

[Ginx snewx]

Well yeah, naturally.  Big storms and two full months of big snowpack for you.

 

That's sort of like give me 2000-2001 for a million, haha.  Big snows and lack of thaw, just becoming insanity in March with 48-60" on the ground in the hill towns.

 

Pros and cons to both types of winter, I think right now I'm just itchy for a 18"+ event (last one was March 2011) after watching huge bombs drop only nickel and dime snowfall here the past few winters. 

 

Now watch we go through like 3 volatile winters but with big snowstorms alternating between rain events, and all the sudden I'm posting "you know it would be nice to have a winter month where it doesn't rain."  You want what you don't have.

Thing is I am totally satiated, a huge storm and then rain will not faze me in the least. 95/96 kept us on our toes, especially with the modeling being so bad, it was just constant action day after day. Best winter ever for a weather lover. non stop action. 

[J.Spin]

So I could see how he would exchange some of the PP days for icy conditions if he gains 10-12 powder days in the process.

 

For someone like you, yeah you want NNE to just get nickled and dimed to death all winter long with no thaws so when you book your vacation you are getting PP conditions.  For folks that live up here, I'm sure J.Spin and ADK would agree, you'll trade some consistency for picking up another dozen powder days over the course of the season.

 

Oh, without a doubt.  Think about it from the perspective of a local who doesn’t have to be on the hill for work; you can easily eschew any icy, or otherwise crappy days and just go out when the snow is great, so there’s tons of upside and potentially little downside to the more volatile pattern.  Imagine a crazy pattern where it snowed 6-12” every fourth day for the whole season, but in between it was a scratchy mess.  Sure, the majority of days during the season were crap, but ask some of the locals and they’d probably look back fondly saying “thanks for the 50 powder days”.

[40/70 Benchmark]

Bingo.  Also look at what I do...I measure snow.  Half the fun of that is actually measuring snow.  Getting to the mountain in the pitch black prior to 5am, checking snow boards by headlamp.  For the majority of the skiers I ski with on a daily basis (pretty much most of this town for example), if I were to take a poll I can promise you most of them would trade say 3 rainers for 12 more powder days. 

 

There's some magic about powder days that's hard to explain...the morning energy at the ski resort is almost addictive.  Plus, snowmaking and grooming equipment is so superior to what it was back in 95-96, conditions can recover in 48 hours following a rain.  Two nights of grooming and snowmaking and you can get a pack powder surface back (even if its on man-made snow). 

 

Another thing I noticed about '95-96 is that when the thaws happened (the decreases in snow depth), the depth doesn't flat-line for a while indicating a thaw followed by no new snow.  It seems to bounce right back up indicating it snowed relatively soon following a rain event.

:weenie: :weenie: :weenie:

[Ginx snewx]

:weenie: :weenie: :weenie:

He is a powder ho/snob/freak for sure.

[CoastalWx]

Man snow FTW.

[SouthCoastMA]

gloppy snow that sticks and accumulates to the sides of vehicles > fairy dust 

[powderfreak]

95-96 was awesome in that is was snow threats for almost 6 months.....6 months! 2002-2003 tried this too with end of October through early April as well.  Nothing will be like last year....but boy...sign me up for 4-5+ months of winter if it means a few nasty cutters. 

 

Even last year was *only* 6 weeks of real winter...really only 4 weeks worth of worthy events though the snowpack lasted so much longer.  Of course it was 4 weeks of winter on absolute steroids.  Well worth it to punt December/most of January to get to the promised land from January 21st or whatever it was until late February.

 

Funny looking at the BOS snow graph...low snowfall, then a one month period where it rises to record snowfall, then flatlines for a while until the record finally falls.  What a freaking period.  1 in 500 year event?

[powderfreak]

:weenie: :weenie: :weenie:

 

A professional weenie.  I know all of you would love it...darkness and the wild of a big mountain in a snowstorm.  Snowflakes flying by sideways in the headlamp, getting into a waiting snowcat as snow pours down...a good time.

 

But I know you are on the big storm train with chances for thaws, over a more sustained cold winter of nickles and dimes.

[powderfreak]

Oh, without a doubt.  Think about it from the perspective of a local who doesn’t have to be on the hill for work; you can easily eschew any icy, or otherwise crappy days and just go out when the snow is great, so there’s tons of upside and potentially little downside to the more volatile pattern.  Imagine a crazy pattern where it snowed 6-12” every fourth day for the whole season, but in between it was a scratchy mess.  Sure, the majority of days during the season were crap, but ask some of the locals and they’d probably look back fondly saying “thanks for the 50 powder days”.

 

Yeah...locals generally judge the season by number of powder days.  If you have 30 straight days of packed powder but it never snows... most locals around here would not look as fondly on that as a month where it rained once a week but there were also 10 powder days where 6"+ fell in that month.

[CoastalWx]

A professional weenie. I know all of you would love it...darkness and the wild of a big mountain in a snowstorm. Snowflakes flying by sideways in the headlamp, getting into a waiting snowcat as snow pours down...a good time.

But I know you are on the big storm train with chances for thaws, over a more sustained cold winter of nickles and dimes.

Sounds like Weymouth.

[40/70 Benchmark]

Even last year was *only* 6 weeks of real winter...really only 4 weeks worth of worthy events though the snowpack lasted so much longer.  Of course it was 4 weeks of winter on absolute steroids.  Well worth it to punt December/most of January to get to the promised land from January 21st or whatever it was until late February.

 

Funny looking at the BOS snow graph...low snowfall, then a one month period where it rises to record snowfall, then flatlines for a while until the record finally falls.  What a freaking period.  1 in 500 year event?

I don't think so moving forward.

[40/70 Benchmark]

A professional weenie.  I know all of you would love it...darkness and the wild of a big mountain in a snowstorm.  Snowflakes flying by sideways in the headlamp, getting into a waiting snowcat as snow pours down...a good time.

 

But I know you are on the big storm train with chances for thaws, over a more sustained cold winter of nickles and dimes.

You should be honored.

I had never dished out a 6-bunner before.