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COVID-19 Talk

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4 hours ago, Akeem the African Dream said:

as a country it’s pretty clear we are ok with north of 50k deaths per month if it means being able to re-open the local TGI Friday’s for in house dining 

 

Truth but we also are the only country to date to use nuclear bombs on civilian populations. It's kind of expected and anything otherwise would be an anomaly.

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4 minutes ago, Vice-Regent said:

Truth but we also are the only country to date to use nuclear bombs on civilian populations. It's kind of expected and anything otherwise would be an anomaly.

Still remains to be seen if it’s the people in charge who are ok with it or if it is us. I’ve seen no evidence that, despite reopenings, people are engaging in economic activity.

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3 minutes ago, Vice-Regent said:

Truth but we also are the only country to date to use nuclear bombs on civilian populations. It's kind of expected and anything otherwise would be an anomaly.

Too many  think of any type of life as an expendable statistic. Unfortunately that type of thinking is likely global. As always ......

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Just now, rclab said:

Too many  think of any type of life as an expendable statistic. Unfortunately that type of thinking is likely global. As always ......

It's too far away and too abstract for people but it's very real. However death anxiety is a problem as well but it's not normal to die from nuclear bombs.

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1 hour ago, ErinInTheSky said:

Still remains to be seen if it’s the people in charge who are ok with it or if it is us. I’ve seen no evidence that, despite reopenings, people are engaging in economic activity.

Go to Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, Target, or any nursery and come back here and tell us what you see.

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The thing that this crisis has really laid bare is how deeply people mistrust institutions and government.  People really think Larry Hogan’s motives are something other than public health. 

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11 minutes ago, DCTeacherman said:

The thing that this crisis has really laid bare is how deeply people mistrust institutions and government.  People really think Larry Hogan’s motives are something other than public health. 

There's bad actors everywhere. There's sociopaths everywhere ... most psychotic apes are more capitalist than otherwise. (not to disparage the ape)

Primate's are highly intelligent and compassionate but somehow despite our IQs and affluence we can't do basic logic. The few shouldn't ruin the show for the many.

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14 minutes ago, EastCoast NPZ said:

Go to Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, Target, or any nursery and come back here and tell us what you see.

So I think people are willing to go to general stores for supplies, for sure.

 

But in every state that has reopened so far, restaurants are dead, nail salons are dead, bars are dead, malls and outlets are dead, movie theater's cant even get customers. I've been posting a ton of reports in this thread. 

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15 minutes ago, ErinInTheSky said:

So I think people are willing to go to general stores for supplies, for sure.

 

But in every state that has reopened so far, restaurants are dead, nail salons are dead, bars are dead, malls and outlets are dead, movie theater's cant even get customers. I've been posting a ton of reports in this thread. 

I'd imagine bars, restaurants, theatres, as well as venues will take some time for people to feel safe enough to venture.  But there are lots of people out shopping.  

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1 minute ago, EastCoast NPZ said:

I'd imagine bars, restaurants, theatres, as well as venues will take some time for people to feel safe enough to venture.  But there are lots of people out shopping.  

It's going to be, at best, a mixed bag and snails pace of economic reopening. I can say one thing is for certain, people who thought many of these industries were being destroyed by lockdowns don't seem to be right. People were avoiding places before the lockdowns, and they'll probably be avoiding them long after until we can feel like we're not at risk and that testing is easily available.

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51 minutes ago, DCTeacherman said:

The thing that this crisis has really laid bare is how deeply people mistrust institutions and government.  People really think Larry Hogan’s motives are something other than public health. 

People don’t trust institutions because they’ve been wrong on everything and keep changing their minds week to week.

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1 hour ago, DCTeacherman said:

The thing that this crisis has really laid bare is how deeply people mistrust institutions and government.  People really think Larry Hogan’s motives are something other than public health. 

"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there always has been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge"." -Isaac Asimov, 1980.

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31 minutes ago, PrinceFrederickWx said:

People don’t trust institutions because they’ve been wrong on everything and keep changing their minds week to week.

I think we have to give some leeway here when it comes to understanding this virus: it's a new virus, and even the best minds are still learning as we go. It's unrealistic to think information and advice won't change as things progress and we learn more about it. We simply don't know everything about this virus yet...so of course guidance is gonna change as new information is learned! Kinda like the weather, you adjust how you prepare and respond as you get more info.

Now, that's for the virus...I won't speak to other reason for government distrust and such (rabbit hole, lol)

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4 minutes ago, Eskimo Joe said:

"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there always has been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge"." -Isaac Asimov, 1980.

I strain to understand arguments made for "intellectualism" when made by those who choose to ignore even the experts in the field in favor of their own, uneducated knowledge (not talking about you, specifically...just to some folks I've seen and heard doing this.). I think mistrust of government unfairly gets cast on the experts officials listen to. 

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1 hour ago, ErinInTheSky said:

So I think people are willing to go to general stores for supplies, for sure.

 

But in every state that has reopened so far, restaurants are dead, nail salons are dead, bars are dead, malls and outlets are dead, movie theater's cant even get customers. I've been posting a ton of reports in this thread. 

Give it a couple of weeks. If there aren't any major setbacks, it will change. Besides place like restaurants will be cutting back on tables, capacities etc. My guess is that  due to America's ability to adapt, things will be getting back to near normal. A lot of fear is being spread especially by some of your sources of information for obvious and not so obvious reasons.

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2 hours ago, Vice-Regent said:

It's too far away and too abstract for people but it's very real. However death anxiety is a problem as well but it's not normal to die from nuclear bombs.

Nor the long lingering aftermath. “and the sun has come to earth” as always ......

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15 minutes ago, Wonderdog said:

Give it a couple of weeks. If there aren't any major setbacks, it will change. Besides place like restaurants will be cutting back on tables, capacities etc. My guess is that  due to America's ability to adapt, things will be getting back to near normal. A lot of fear is being spread especially by some of your sources of information for obvious and not so obvious reasons.

there is a deadly pathogen all over the planet for which there is neither a treatment nor a cure. because of insufficient testing, we do not know which asymptomatic people are spreading this highly contagious disease in our communities. sources telling people that this is a very serious situation are not fear-mongering.

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13 minutes ago, Wonderdog said:

Give it a couple of weeks. If there aren't any major setbacks, it will change. Besides place like restaurants will be cutting back on tables, capacities etc. My guess is that  due to America's ability to adapt, things will be getting back to near normal. A lot of fear is being spread especially by some of your sources of information for obvious and not so obvious reasons.

Well that’s the key, isn’t it?

Everyone knows I’m not in favor of swinging the doors open fully anywhere (I doubt many are), but given the positive trends in some areas, I think it’s appropriate to discuss and at an appropriate time implement a smart and gradual reopening. 

If things open and cases/hospitalizations remain level or drop, yes, I agree many people will become more comfortable. We want less cases and more confidence that the worst is over because of the unprecedented action we took. But if this reopening process fails and we’re losing more Americans in June than we did during the awful month of April, it’d be devastating to both the public health and economy. 

To the fear piece, I’m not sure what you’re specifically referring to, but I don’t think there’s any objective argument that this isn’t serious. Policy makers and the public have to be cautious and careful. As Dr. Fauci said, you want to be criticized for doing too much in this situation. If we screw this up, people who don’t have to die, will. 

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4 hours ago, PrinceFrederickWx said:

Hogan should spend less time puffing his chest about MARYLAND STRONG and more time fixing the broken unemployment system. My brother waited online for 6 hours to refile, then got an automated form in the mail saying he had to call- and the line has been busy for days, you can never get through. Meanwhile he didn't get paid, his career has been destroyed, and he's running out of money...

The snarky comments on here about "awww Karen can't get her nails done!" -no, it's a lot worse than that.

He got a mass E-mail sent out- unfortunately as MD switched to the new system, it inactivated thousands of claims by mistake last week. They're working to get this fixed ASAP and get the money out. What a mess.

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10 minutes ago, Wonderdog said:

Give it a couple of weeks. If there aren't any major setbacks, it will change. Besides place like restaurants will be cutting back on tables, capacities etc. My guess is that  due to America's ability to adapt, things will be getting back to near normal. A lot of fear is being spread especially by some of your sources of information for obvious and not so obvious reasons.

We'll see. Georgia's been open for a while.

 

"At the Mall of Georgia, for example, where there are thousands of parking spaces, there were only a few dozen cars in front of mall's main entrance, with similar small scatterings of cars located at other entrances that were open, including entrances to anchor stores, such as Macy's.

There were small clusters of shoppers to be found here and there in the mall, but not the throngs of crowds that would typically be seen at the Mall of Georgia.

"It's a ghost town," Ricky Wuorinen added."

https://www.gwinnettdailypost.com/local/crowds-light-as-mall-of-georgia-sugarloaf-mills-reopen

 

 

Youn, a psychology student at Georgia State University, was working fewer hours and struggling to make tips. Usually she made $100 to $130 in tips each day. On her last shift, she made just $25.

“It’s pretty slow,” she said Thursday afternoon. “I thought people would be tired of staying home, but no one has come in all day.”

https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-05-01/its-too-soon-in-small-towns-and-big-cities-georgias-experiment-in-reopening-moves-slowly

 

 

 

and as I was typing this, a new poll just came out. People are opposed to re-openings.

 

 

So... it's not like if you reopen, people are going to rush to consume.

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7 minutes ago, WxWatcher007 said:

Well that’s the key, isn’t it?

Everyone knows I’m not in favor of swinging the doors open fully anywhere (I doubt many are), but given the positive trends in some areas, I think it’s appropriate to discuss and at an appropriate time implement a smart and gradual reopening. 

If things open and cases/hospitalizations remain level or drop, yes, I agree many people will become more comfortable. We want less cases and more confidence that the worst is over because of the unprecedented action we took. But if this reopening process fails and we’re losing more Americans in June than we did during the awful month of April, it’d be devastating to both the public health and economy. 

To the fear piece, I’m not sure what you’re specifically referring to, but I don’t think there’s any objective argument that this isn’t serious. Policy makers and the public have to be cautious and careful. As Dr. Fauci said, you want to be criticized for doing too much in this situation. If we screw this up, people who don’t have to die, will. 

Good post.  Maybe I’m overly pessimistic, but I fail to see how we can possibly lose less people in June - when things will be open and people out and about  - than we did in April when things were generally closed and people were home.  

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1 hour ago, ErinInTheSky said:

Heading for another 2k+ day. The curse of weekend numbers strikes again.

If you look at the long term curve it’s easy to figure out where we really are ignoring the predictable weekly fluctuations due to reporting procedures. 

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11 minutes ago, jaydreb said:

Good post.  Maybe I’m overly pessimistic, but I fail to see how we can possibly lose less people in June - when things will be open and people out and about  - than we did in April when things were generally closed and people were home.  

The models, even when taken with a grain of salt, are deeply concerning. 

We don’t know how things will go, but it’s my hope that unlike in early March, when there was unmitigated transmission, the public at large is able to take steps to minimize any second summer wave as we open up. Polling still shows an overwhelming majority of Americans are or plan to act with caution.

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NY is finally approaching adequate testing for making contact tracing possible.

 

Generally you need positive percentage in the 3-5% range, and a large contact tracing army. The contact tracing army funding may come this week in congress.

 

 

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