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Winter 2013-14 Pattern Discussion III


Marion_NC_WX

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The 12z EURO doesn't limit qpf in the NW piedmont. They wrote that after the latest EURO was out, but they must be talking about the 0z EURO. The 12z is a classic winter storm for a large area of NC, including the NW piedmont.

We had large late March snowstorms in 81 and 83, so not unprecedented.

 

Apparently, there were a slew of late March storms in the 1960s, 1970s, and early 1980s.  There was also the April 19, 1987 storm in Raleigh that dropped a couple inches.  It would be nice if we could return to a regional climatic pattern where late winter (or early spring) storms become more prevalent again.  That's probably just climate wishcasting, though. :)

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Just looked at the snow total,23 1/4, for you this winter. I'm setting at 23 in. and we may not be through.

My point is would you have ever believed we would have this much snow with a positive NAO ?

No Sir, Goes to show you there is a lot of different drivers in the weather! Can't always count on one driver!!!  I would love to see another big snow though. :snowwindow:

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Posted in The Banter Thread.  GSP AFD seems 'excited'.

 

GSP AFD
 
 
.LONG TERM /SATURDAY NIGHT THROUGH WEDNESDAY/...
AS OF 145 PM WED...AS ONE SHORTWAVE AND ATTENDANT SFC LOW DEPART NEW
ENGLAND SATURDAY NIGHT...A SECOND SHORTWAVE BEGINS TO ROTATE THRU THE
LONGWAVE TROUGH OVER THE ERN CONUS. SPRAWLING HIGH PRESSURE SPREADS
OUT OF THE MIDWEST BEHIND IT. A FAIRLY WEAK BUT MOIST FRONTAL
BOUNDARY WILL SAG ACRS OUR REGION THRU SUNDAY AHEAD OF THE HIGH. BEST
DPVA MOVES ACRS THE MID-ATLANTIC TO OUR NORTH WITH WEAK TROUGHING
GIVING WAY TO NEARLY ZONAL UPPER FLOW BY SUNDAY NIGHT. COLDER AND
DRIER AIR FILTERS IN FOR MONDAY.
 
TUESDAY SEES THE UPPER PATTERN REAMPLIFY AS CLIPPER DIVES INTO THE
MIDWEST...AND A NEW PUSH OF ARCTIC AIR ARRIVES IN THE SRN APPALACHIAN
REGION. GFS/EC BOTH DEVELOP A SFC LOW OFF THE COAST OF GA AND NRN FL
IN RESPONSE TO THE AMPLIFICATION. CMC LOOKS FISHY...IS VIEWED AS AN
OUTLIER...AND WILL BE DISCOUNTED AT THIS TIME. THE LOW TRACKS
OFFSHORE ON BOTH GFS/EC BY TUE NIGHT...BUT THERE ARE THE USUAL
DIFFERENCES IN TRACK WHICH LEAD TO DRAMATICALLY DIFFERENT EFFECTS IN
OUR AREA. GFS CONTINUES TO BE STRONGER WITH THE SFC LOW THAN THE
EC...AND THEREFORE COLDER AND WETTER OVER THE CWFA. EC PARTIAL
THICKNESSES ARE STILL COLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SOME PTYPE CONCERNS TUE BUT
THE GFS IS MORE THREATENING...BRINGING A WIDE RANGE OF PTYPES TO MOST
OF THE FA. THERE DOES SEEM TO BE DECENT SUPPORT FOR SUFFICIENT COLD
AIR FROM 12Z GFS...00Z EC AND THE 06Z GFS ENSEMBLE. PSU NORMALIZED
ANOMALIES OF 850MB TEMPS RUN FROM THE GFS ENSEMBLE MEAN ARE 2-3 STD
DEV ON THE COLD SIDE. HOWEVER SPAGHETTI PLOTS OF THE LOW TRACKS ARE
FAIRLY WELL SPREAD ACRS THE OPNL GFS-EC SPECTRUM...THOUGH MORE
MEMBERS FAVOR THE MORE SOUTHERLY AND OFFSHORE EC TRACK. ENSEMBLE
PROBABILITIES OF QPF SUPPORTIVE OF WARNING CRITERIA SNOW ARE LOW. I
WAS NOT SHY ABOUT INCLUDING WINTRY PTYPES IN THE FCST...BUT HAVE
PEAKED POPS IN SOLID CHC RANGE AND KEPT QPF LOW. WE WILL CONTINUE TO
MONITOR THE TRENDS OVER THE NEXT FEW SHIFTS.
 
OTHER THAN A BRIEF SHOT OF NW FLOW SNOW IN THE MTNS EARLY WED...DRY
HIGH PRESSURE BUILDS IN FOR THE REST OF THE FCST PERIOD...WITH TEMPS
REMAINING A COUPLE CATEGORIES BELOW NORMAL.
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Euro Ens looks similar to last run with overall features, but a bit stronger with the sfc low off the SE coast, a bit colder, and slightly better with the digging trough.  850 0 deg at warmest point of the storm runs from GA Mtns to Laurinburg, NC to Greenville, NC.

 

For NC, the 0Z Euro ens. mean had mainly 1-2" of SN on 3/25-6. The 12Z Euro ens. mean had ~1" more with 2-3" of SN, which should be a pretty legit clown due to a relative lack of IP/ZR. Also, in upstate and far NE GA, there is ~1" on the 12Z vs. less on the 0Z.

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Apparently, there were a slew of late March storms in the 1960s, 1970s, and early 1980s.  There was also the April 19, 1987 storm in Raleigh that dropped a couple inches.  It would be nice if we could return to a regional climatic pattern where late winter (or early spring) storms become more prevalent again.  That's probably just climate wishcasting, though. :)

 

James,

 I had seen several posts from you about the early 70's having several NC winter storms in late March. I already had known about the major 3/25-6/71 SE storm affecting GA/SC/NC. I hadn't known about any other winter storms in the early 70's because ATL/SAV hadn't received any sig. wintry precip. However, I just finished researching old late March daily data for 1972-4 and found that they all produced sig. wintry precip. in the piedmont of NC in late March: 3/25-6/71, 3/25/72, 3/21/73, and 3/25/74. Even more amazing is that the 3/25-6 period produced sig to major wintry precip. during the 3/25-6 period during three years of that four year period!! (Aside: there was also a big snow 3/24/1983.) By the way, at GSO, there was also moderate ZR on 3/23/1989 and 1.2" of SN at GSO on 3/30/2003.

 

 With there being a progged threat for late 3/24 through 3/25, perhaps this has an even better chance than I had realized based on this climo pattern, especially for NC and extra especially for GSO.

 

Edit: I just discovered that GSO got a whopping 7.6" 3/22-23/1981! Interestingly, although the coldest was 32, it was mainly 33-34 when it was snowing. I need to add this one to my list for GSO late March hits. However, RDU, CLT, and GSP got only a T as it was too warm for accumulations.

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MAR 21st 12Z GFS model run continues to support a winter storm across the piedmont to the coastal plain of North Carolina for this upcoming Tuesday. Unusual run to run consistency and model agreement (GFS & ECMWF) this far out leads to higher confidence than normal. However, until the medium range models pick it up and the attending trough itself is sampled across N.A. I have not completely bought into these solutions.

 

Interestingly, as RDUWX mentions a couple of posts up the models have been trending cooler for a weaker low moving across the state Sunday night suggesting a change over from rain/mix to mix/snow in many places across the northern half of NC similar to several storms we have had throughout this winter.

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Winter just doesn't want to give up. But there maybe flakes and slop flying early tomorrow morning from the foot hills into the northern half of NC into southern VA. RAH hasn't mentioned anything. Blacksburg mentioned a R/S mix possible east of the Blue Ridge.

 

Time frame looks to be roughly 4am to about 11 and will be associated with the departing UL that will bring snow to the mountains tonight and tomorrow.

 

But it appears temps aloft tomorrow morning appear marginal and will be precip rate dependent. Cold air will begin moving into the area tonight on a W/SW flow then NW with the foothills and northern piedmont dropping near 40. 

 

It very well may not snow/sleet in those areas due to the angle of the exiting trough axis. Downslope/drying will be starting as soon as it pulls away from the mountians. But right now if anybody see anything CLT,HKY triad north maybe the sweet spot to see flurries/sleet in the morning.

 

nam-hires_namer_024_sim_reflectivity.gif

nam-hires_namer_024_850_temp_ht.gif

nam-hires_namer_024_925_temp_ht.gifgfs_namer_024_700_rh_ht.gif

gfs_namer_024_925_temp_ht.gif

gfs_namer_024_850_temp_ht.gif

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