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Central PA Winter 23/24


Voyager
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6 minutes ago, Blizzard of 93 said:

Nice shift south on the 12z EPS as well.

12z top

6z bottom 

 

 

Enough ticks south to say nooners went the right way for us, as we've got several of em showing hits of various proportions.  

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4 minutes ago, canderson said:

If the GFS was ever to kick the Euro's ass, a Presidents' Day storm should be the time. 

as I said a couple times now, the normally bashed GFS Op at meduim/longer leads has had a decent run in the medium range this season, and while I know it shows what we want to see, there is valid reason the hug the hell outta it....for now.  

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31 minutes ago, Bubbler86 said:

I saw that mention on the MA that the Icon is now ranked higher than the GFS in some type of verification?  Does anyone have a link to that...or at least some info including timelines? 

I saw Hoffman post that he read "somewhere " that it was ranked higher. He didn't say where he read it. Here's a link for ratings of the main models. The difference between Euro, Gem, Ukie, and Gfs is very small.

https://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/users/verification/headlines/acc_31days/

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7 minutes ago, mitchnick said:

I saw Hoffman post that he read "somewhere " that it was ranked higher. He didn't say where he read it. Here's a link for ratings of the main models. The difference between Euro, Gem, Ukie, and Gfs is very small.

https://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/users/verification/headlines/acc_31days/

Thanks, I have seen that one from ncep but was curious who was ranking the Icon ahead of the GFS.  That is a pretty big claim but maybe right if data backs it.  I think I saw the same post from PSU which piqued my interest. 

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Just now, Bubbler86 said:

Thanks, I have seen that one from ncep but was curious who was ranking the Icon ahead of the GFS.  That is a pretty big claim but maybe right if data backs it.  I think I saw the same post from PSU which piqued my interest. 

Even if he saw something that it was beating the Gfs, what period of time are we talking? Those ratings are done once a month, so unless there's some confirmation it's true and over what period of time, people should stop repeating it as gospel.

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Just now, mitchnick said:

Even if he saw something that it was beating the Gfs, what period of time are we talking? Those ratings are done once a month, so unless there's some confirmation it's true and over what period of time, people should stop repeating it as gospel.

That was my goal in finding out re: the first comment.   The timelines/time period was important to understand what it really means if true. 

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11 minutes ago, mitchnick said:

I saw Hoffman post that he read "somewhere " that it was ranked higher. He didn't say where he read it. Here's a link for ratings of the main models. The difference between Euro, Gem, Ukie, and Gfs is very small.

https://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/users/verification/headlines/acc_31days/

I have a few takeaways from this.  Firstly, is that the Euro is still the top model, and not simply because it has the highest average correlation coefficient, but also because it seems to have significantly less variability than the other models and avoids some of the wild swings and misses.  Steady as she goes, some would say.  Secondly, the Ukie is still a very solid model in terms of large scale pattern recognition.  Thirdly, these data are only taken from the 0z runs over a one-month period, not exactly large sample and prone to some skewing if you have a couple of bad singular runs.

I also looked at the same scoring but as an annual average over the last 40 years, https://www.emc.ncep.noaa.gov/users/verification/headlines/acc_annual/ which shows that, while the gap has narrowed, there has never been a year when the Euro didn't lead the way over the other major models.  Also, for almost the last 20 years, every single year the UK has outscored the GFS, which I think would be a surprise to many, and in fact, even the CMC outscored it the last couple of years.  In total, all of the models perform much better these days and the gap between them is mostly negligible.

Now, these scores only relate to H500 placement and there is obviously more to predicting everyday on-the-ground weather than that, but they seem as good a place as any to start.  Mostly these are fringe differences that would be hard to detect by an observer casually checking all the models on a regular basis.  Just my thoughts.   

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