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Upstate NY/North Country + adjacent ON, QC, VT: End of Winter/Spring


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Yeah that makes sense. It seems I have been in pretty good locations for most of these storms haha.

 

Lived in west side of Buffalo for the 1995 event, Cheektowaga/Amherst border for 2000/2001/2006. Northern OP for 2010 and Hamburg for the 2014 events. The LES follows me. :snowing:

February 2007 verified a blizzard on campus on the Monday morning after the Superbowl...so it had a great combination of huge totals, a blizzard, and extremely cold temperatures.  We even had thundersnow with 850s of -26c because of the extreme lake induced instability.  Late season very cold events rarely have lightning due to lack of graupel in the cloud layer.  

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February 2007 verified a blizzard on campus on the Monday morning after the Superbowl...so it had a great combination of huge totals, a blizzard, and extremely cold temperatures.  We even had thundersnow with 850s of -26c because of the extreme lake induced instability.  Late season very cold events rarely have lightning due to lack of graupel in the cloud layer.  

 

Yeah, that definitely would of been number 1 on my list to.

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February 2007 had the greatest lake induced instability that I've ever observed.  It had 2200j/kg of cape, which is greater than November 2000 and even the historic October storm.  500mb temps were -46c during that storm and Lake Ontario was still 5C.  

Wow that is insane...What were the parameters during Dec. 2001? I know the lake was like 40-50 degrees at the time?

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How were parameters like you mentioned experienced in 2007 so late in the season?

Lake Ontario was much above normal for the date, and the PV that dropped NE of the lakes had an exceptionally deep and cold airmass.  The 1000-500mb thickness were about 488 dm that night, and the les conditions were favorable at the same time.  

 

500s that cold are quite rare...I'm not sure of the exact hemispheric mechanism for why some PV chunks will have -35c 500s and others will have -45c 500s.  

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Lake Ontario was much above normal for the date, and the PV that dropped NE of the lakes had an exceptionally deep and cold airmass.  The 1000-500mb thickness were about 488 dm that night, and the les conditions were favorable at the same time.  

 

500s that cold are quite rare...I'm not sure of the exact hemispheric mechanism for why some PV chunks will have -35c 500s and others will have -45c 500s.  

 

I thought the 850s (1500 meters) were the location to look at for delta ts?

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I thought the 850s (1500 meters) were the location to look at for delta ts?

they are, but you can still look at delta Ts with respect to other levels.  Good LES events will also have a greater than 28C lapse (dry adiabatic) from the lake to 700mb.  The most insane events will have a lake to 500 difference of close to 54C.  

 

That's when you know the band will have depth since the cold air has depth.  If you're inversion is just above 850mb, you're not going to have good les. 

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they are, but you can still look at delta Ts with respect to other levels.  Good LES events will also have a greater than 28C lapse (dry adiabatic) from the lake to 700mb.  The most insane events will have a lake to 500 difference of close to 54C.  

 

That's when you know the band will have depth since the cold air has depth.  If you're inversion is just above 850mb, you're not going to have good les. 

 

Makes perfect sense thanks. BTW what causes thunder within LES. Does it have to do with the Delta Ts in relation to 500, 700, 850 mb or a combination of all 3?

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Makes perfect sense thanks. BTW what causes thunder within LES. Does it have to do with the Delta Ts in relation to 500, 700, 850 mb or a combination of all 3?

It's a combination of depth, vertical velocities, and how much graupel in the cloud layer.  Basically you want the graupel to bounce off each other quickly to create a large net charge separation.  

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That must of been awesome to experience the 2007 storm, how much did Oswego receive during that? I know East Aurora had something like 45 inches from that storm.

In Parish, when I lived there in 2007, we received 127" over 6.5 days...with 100" of it occurring in 4.5 days.  Chased with some of the old Eastern (some current American) board member (Randy (stormtracker), Dan, our own Brian (Gravestone), Matt (zywts), donsutherland, Keith, Dan (danstorm), Midlosnowmaker, forky, Howard, and many others...along with TWC and my national debut ;)

 

(for those who haven't seen my shameless plug!)  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT746bBEdMk

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In Parish, when I lived there in 2007, we received 127" over 6.5 days...with 100" of it occurring in 4.5 days.  Chased with some of the old Eastern (some current American) board member (Randy (stormtracker), Dan, our own Brian (Gravestone), Matt (zywts), donsutherland, Keith, Dan (danstorm), Midlosnowmaker, forky, Howard, and many others...along with TWC and my national debut ;)

 

(for those who haven't seen my shameless plug!)  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT746bBEdMk

 

Haha, awesome!

 

I was in high school near Albany at the time and remember being so jealous of those areas.

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In Parish, when I lived there in 2007, we received 127" over 6.5 days...with 100" of it occurring in 4.5 days.  Chased with some of the old Eastern (some current American) board member (Randy (stormtracker), Dan, our own Brian (Gravestone), Matt (zywts), donsutherland, Keith, Dan (danstorm), Midlosnowmaker, forky, Howard, and many others...along with TWC and my national debut ;)

 

(for those who haven't seen my shameless plug!)  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT746bBEdMk

 

OMG this is awesome! Did you guys take any videos of the chase?

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In Parish, when I lived there in 2007, we received 127" over 6.5 days...with 100" of it occurring in 4.5 days. Chased with some of the old Eastern (some current American) board member (Randy (stormtracker), Dan, our own Brian (Gravestone), Matt (zywts), donsutherland, Keith, Dan (danstorm), Midlosnowmaker, forky, Howard, and many others...along with TWC and my national debut ;)

(for those who haven't seen my shameless plug!)

That was a fun trip...those in my vehicle hauled an army guy and his wife from down south, out of a snow bank. Who says chasing doesn't serve a societal need? ;)

I can also verify ~100" around Oswego that week. We never had a "snow day" at work though i spent at least 1/2 of one day helping extract a coworker from a snow bank on Silk Rd in about 100' visibility. A total clusterf*** that week. Afterwards, you could tell where the National Guard plows had been...by the lines of smashed mailboxes alongside the road...

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