Chicago Storm Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 This thread is an indication of a last ditch effort for those who love the Winter more than they should... I for one love all 4 seasons! Its like sports...In Detroit we are blessed with 4 pro teams..Hockey, Football (lol) ,Baseball and Basket Ball. Many of us have our preference on which sport is considered our favorite..But after a 4 months of Hockey (winter) your just itching for some Baseball( spring/summer) By the end of Baseball season your just dying for some Football (fall) And then basketball and hockey for the winter.. To rip on us folks who simply want the seasons to change is wrong...Yea I can see Feb 1st being a little early..But after March 1st...Im dying for some Baseball! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted March 3, 2011 Author Share Posted March 3, 2011 This thread is an indication of a last ditch effort for those who love the Winter more than they should... I for one love all 4 seasons! Its like sports...In Detroit we are blessed with 4 pro teams..Hockey, Football (lol) ,Baseball and Basket Ball. Many of us have our preference on which sport is considered our favorite..But after a 4 months of Hockey (winter) your just itching for some Baseball( spring/summer) By the end of Baseball season your just dying for some Football (fall) And then basketball and hockey for the winter.. To rip on us folks who simply want the seasons to change is wrong...Yea I can see Feb 1st being a little early..But after March 1st...Im dying for some Baseball! Unlike you and a few others i know what CLIMO says. Thus try again. You don't like winter wx beyond March 1st then i suggest moving down south where it has less of a chance of happening. Reasons why Last March and the March before was the first time EVER a number of locations came in with less then a inch. Thus shattered some records for LEAST snowfall in the month of March back to back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago WX Posted March 3, 2011 Share Posted March 3, 2011 This thread is an indication of a last ditch effort for those who love the Winter more than they should... I for one love all 4 seasons! Its like sports...In Detroit we are blessed with 4 pro teams..Hockey, Football (lol) ,Baseball and Basket Ball. Many of us have our preference on which sport is considered our favorite..But after a 4 months of Hockey (winter) your just itching for some Baseball( spring/summer) By the end of Baseball season your just dying for some Football (fall) And then basketball and hockey for the winter.. To rip on us folks who simply want the seasons to change is wrong...Yea I can see Feb 1st being a little early..But after March 1st...Im dying for some Baseball! Well isn't this the thread for people who want winter to continue or are wishing for more snowfall? Why is there debate going on about the subject of winter vs spring inside this thread? Those that wish for spring are more than happy to express that sentiment in the general March thread. Either way, nobody should cross thread snipe at each other either. To each his own for what they want to happen, but everyone is different in their preferences. Just the facts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IWXwx Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 This thread is an indication of a last ditch effort for those who love the Winter more than they should... I for one love all 4 seasons! Its like sports...In Detroit we are blessed with 4 pro teams..Hockey, Football (lol) ,Baseball and Basket Ball. Many of us have our preference on which sport is considered our favorite..But after a 4 months of Hockey (winter) your just itching for some Baseball( spring/summer) By the end of Baseball season your just dying for some Football (fall) And then basketball and hockey for the winter.. To rip on us folks who simply want the seasons to change is wrong...Yea I can see Feb 1st being a little early..But after March 1st...Im dying for some Baseball! The MI torchatie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 The MI torchatie? Well..... Would I enjoy a 24 incher in April? Yes Would I enjoy 50-60s degrees on opening day ? Yes Am I a torchatie...if you say so I guess. Climo wise...You correct we are no where close to finishing this Winter. True on that! I think why a few of us have chimed in on this 4th grade debate..Is only because of the 1st post on the topic..Complaining and bitching/moaning about a lack of spring...? That spells a debate! Whatever. I love you all and love this site..Move on time for me! And yes...heres to an early spring Blizzard! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michsnowfreak Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I know everyone is on the bandwagon about how snowy things have been and that people have no right to complain about the lack of snow recently...but given that this is a winter enthusiast's thread, I'll vent my winter frustration here. ORD has only seen 2.9" of snow since 2/9/11 (basically 3 separate tiny events), with not much more on the horizon. This is pathetic and needs to be acknowledged, especially when everyone says we can't complain about the lack of winter anymore. As I've said many times before...if I knew in November that an upcoming suburban Chicago winter would feature average temps and snowfall, it would be horrible. Chicago is not a wintry place, period. We only have a 40% chance of seeing a White Christmas...and that includes many instances with only 1" or 2" on the ground (some bare spots). So, the chance of a truly White Christmas (3"+ depth) is probably around 20-25%. A true wintry place would talk about how the snowpack changes and peaks throughout the season...whereas in Chicago, it doesn't make sense to discuss this, as we're without a snowpack on many days during DJF. A snowpack should be depended on...the only question should be how deep. But not in Chicago, Detroit, LAF, STL, etc. 38" of snow in an entire season is really crappy...yeah, it's climo, but face it, Chicago metro's climo sucks for winter lovers. Why do we sugarcoat this? Why do we try to convince ourselves otherwise? Just because the media and 90% of the general public complains about winter in Chicago, doesn't mean that winter is actually "wintry" here. For example, to think that the avg. Feb. snowfall in Chicago is only 8"...that's a winter month! 2" of snow per week during the heart of winter is not exactly a wintry climate. Yes, the early Feb. blizzard was great and means that this winter gets a B- in my opinion (instead of a D+ without the blizzard). It was a phenomenal event, as I saw my first lightning strikes ever during a snowstorm. But with that said, true winter is measured by its consistency...like you can wake up on a winter morning and know it will be really cold outside. The question would just be exactly how cold. The fact that the blizzard's snowfall melted within 10 days, and that we've had hardly any snow since 2/9/11, needs to be considered when evaluating the winter as a whole. Heck, many places in the northeast (NH and VT) have 4 feet on the ground and 100"++ this season...not saying we should see as much as them, but it makes our climo look even more pathetic. Josh and I have these debates all the time...and I concede that I see the glass half empty when it comes to climo. I totally understand his perspective too...but in a practical sense, I don't know why people think that Chicago has a wintry climate in DJF. It's just not true. At the end of the day, it bothers me to no end that the media and the general public think winter is so bad here. Even when we actually do get a little bit of wintry weather, no one wants to embrace it. Why do people have such a poor attitude? Is our culture really that wimpy? Ok, rant over... First off I agree the media is ridiculous when it comes to everything about snow. And I will say its SO refreshing to see someone in our region who feels (weatherwise) the need to move to a harsher winter climate, because lets face it, thousands from our region move to or at least winter in warmer climes because of how harsh our winters are, and I cringe everytime I hear of such a story. So I love love LOVE hearing a true winter lover like you flat out saying "this is NOT enough snow, I need more". Now that said...I will continue to disagree with you. First off, paring Detroit/Chicago and St Louis in the same boat wrt snowcover is ridiculous. Detroit/Chicago average about 50 days per winter of 1"+ snowcover, and St Louis averages under 25 days. Go just outside of ORD/DTW and the snowcover days go way up as well. Bottom line is this: Chicago/Detroit winters are harsher (cold+snow+snowcover) than those in 80% of the country. So to say they arent wintry climes isnt just silly, its ridiculous. You are talking about places with the harshest winters in the country (NH/VT) and acting like thats the bar of what real winter is and anything else isnt. (Although you did throw in a bit of exaggeration as well....many places have 4 feet on the ground? REALLY? because a check of snow depth in those states shows, although still the highest area in the country, a range from 1 to 3 feet). Another thing is impact: The size of the Chicago/Detroit metropolitan areas makes snow a little harder to deal with than those areas with much harsher winters, as those are more rural areas. Of the top 30 metros in the country, the only ones with winters comparable to or harsher than Detroit/Chicago is Boston, Pittsburgh, Denver, Cleveland, and Minneapolis. We have had snow on the ground for just about a solid 3 months now (only 5 bare days in the last 3 months), while this is absolutely above normal, you know darn well snow is usually on the ground in the heart of winter. And here in southeast Michigan we average seeing snow in the air on 70-90 days per winter. Winter is cold as well. Rarely do we go through long stretches of bare ground in the winter, and while we usually see thaws, you know most of an average winter is spent in the deep freeze. "You dont know why people think Chicago has a wintry climate in DJF because its not true"? Chicagos D+J+F temps is 27.4F+22.0F+27.0F. Plus frequent snowfall. You said winter should be dependable and for the most part it is here. You say people sugarcoat things but in stark contrast it would appear you are painting a much gloomer picture than reality. Chicago has a 40% chance of white christmas but usually its 1-2" which means bare spots? Come on, really? Where are you even getting? I know Detroit averages 6" more of snow than Chicago and a few more days snowcover, but for all intents and purposes the climes are VERY similar. So Id have to ask Chicagowx, but it really seems like you are trying your best to make Chicago sound less wintry than it is. Basically Ill sum it up. What consititues "snowy/wintry climate" is clearly an opinion. Everyone has their own definitions of that. Clearly you need to move to a snowier place to be happy with the weather. But in the big picture of this country, Chicago/Detroit absolutely are wintry climates. And when I said we see harsher winters than 80% of the country, I was referring to land-wise. Many of the places that see harsher winters are less populated, so honestly, I could easily see it being that our winters are harsher than those experienced by 85% of the people in this country. I know we will continue to disagree, but it is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tropical Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Normals now are the same as late November. Local met here posted best snow chances in March are the first week (coincides with first week of December climo-wise). After that it's a crapshoot. This will be the main theme of March.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmichweather Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Normals now are the same as late November. Local met here posted best snow chances in March are the first week (coincides with first week of December climo-wise). After that it's a crapshoot. This will be the main theme of March.... lol oh boy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michsnowfreak Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 This thread is an indication of a last ditch effort for those who love the Winter more than they should... I for one love all 4 seasons! Its like sports...In Detroit we are blessed with 4 pro teams..Hockey, Football (lol) ,Baseball and Basket Ball. Many of us have our preference on which sport is considered our favorite..But after a 4 months of Hockey (winter) your just itching for some Baseball( spring/summer) By the end of Baseball season your just dying for some Football (fall) And then basketball and hockey for the winter.. To rip on us folks who simply want the seasons to change is wrong...Yea I can see Feb 1st being a little early..But after March 1st...Im dying for some Baseball! I enjoy the transition from snow to Tigers...March is snow, April is Tigers Oh storm time for me btw. What do I mean? All winter long Im loving every flake, every inch, every refresher snow etc....because to me deep winter is about looking like winter, feeling like winter, flakes in the air, and SNOWCOVER! (which we had an awesome one this year). It was actually kind of sad this winter seeing a decent amount of folks in this region complaining, or at least lamenting, about lack of an epic storm while all the while they had to measure the snowdepth in their backyard with a yardstick. Then of course much of the rest of the general public was complaining for OTHER reasons (too much snow). So surrounded by all the complaining, I was in my own world of bliss with snow everywhere, and I loved it. Well.......now the sun is getting stronger by the day, and the snowcover days are quickly on the wane. So I now turn into snowSTORM-mode. Knowing snow doesnt last, Im high gear hoping for the BIG storms (whereas in mid-winter im happy with any and all snow). Bring on April 1886 redux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosier Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Normals now are the same as late November. Local met here posted best snow chances in March are the first week (coincides with first week of December climo-wise). After that it's a crapshoot. This will be the main theme of March.... You should put your location in your profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago Storm Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 You should put your location in your profile. Saukville, WI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River Card Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Saukville, WI. Suckville, WI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michsnowfreak Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Saukville, WI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mnchaser Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Heck, many places in the northeast (NH and VT) have 4 feet on the ground and 100"++ this season...not saying we should see as much as them, but it makes our climo look even more pathetic. There is a point where you are borderline too much snow, and that's pushing it! If you want to take our regions climo as a whole..Then we definitely win with the variety of weather we see here in the plains and midwest. I don't think I could live anywhere else. For example, The past year in southern MN we went from a humid summer and a record tornado season with the most tornadoes then ANY other state in 2010 to one of the snowiest winters most cities have seen in quite sometime or ever! I guess the winter just fills the gap for me though until tornado season kicks up again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stebo Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Saukville, WI. this, maybe he needs the door Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I enjoy the transition from snow to Tigers...March is snow, April is Tigers Oh storm time for me btw. What do I mean? All winter long Im loving every flake, every inch, every refresher snow etc....because to me deep winter is about looking like winter, feeling like winter, flakes in the air, and SNOWCOVER! (which we had an awesome one this year). It was actually kind of sad this winter seeing a decent amount of folks in this region complaining, or at least lamenting, about lack of an epic storm while all the while they had to measure the snowdepth in their backyard with a yardstick. Then of course much of the rest of the general public was complaining for OTHER reasons (too much snow). So surrounded by all the complaining, I was in my own world of bliss with snow everywhere, and I loved it. Well.......now the sun is getting stronger by the day, and the snowcover days are quickly on the wane. So I now turn into snowSTORM-mode. Knowing snow doesnt last, Im high gear hoping for the BIG storms (whereas in mid-winter im happy with any and all snow). Bring on April 1886 redux Godspeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 For those that do not know what us SEMI folks are talking about..Here you go. In April 1886 a freak Blizzard struck Detroit dumping 25 inches on the city. Some of us think we are due for a repeat and rightfully so considering the lack of a "true" SEMI Blizzard in over 100 years.. This is copied from the DTX website. It is an entry in a weather log. http://www.crh.noaa....x/1886-1974.php "Snow began at 12:30 AM and fell light until about 4:30 AM when it began to fall heavy and a tremendous fall of snow continued all day, ending at 9:00 PM. The fall at 7:00 AM was 4.6" and at 3:00 PM was 17.1" and at 11:00 PM, 2.4" making the total of 24.1 inches melted from the snow gauge. The rain gauge was soon snowed full and was practically useless. Total fall of the snow on the level was 24.5 inches. The snow was badly drifted by the heavy gale. The drifts in some places were 12 feet high and the snow in the street was from 10" to 40" inches deep. A heavy north gale set in at 1:45 AM and raged in fury all day reaching 40 miles north at 2:15 PM and continued all the remainder of the day. Its force with the snow was appalling. It blew the snow in fine particles against the face, cutting like a knife." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Think about that ! What are the odds of a 25 inch Blizzard hitting in early April.? To top that off ,it happened in SEMI of all places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michsnowfreak Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 For those that do not know what us SEMI folks are talking about..Here you go. In April 1886 a freak Blizzard struck Detroit dumping 25 inches on the city. Some of us think we are due for a repeat and rightfully so considering the lack of a "true" SEMI Blizzard in over 100 years.. This is copied from the DTX website. It is an entry in a weather log. http://www.crh.noaa....x/1886-1974.php "Snow began at 12:30 AM and fell light until about 4:30 AM when it began to fall heavy and a tremendous fall of snow continued all day, ending at 9:00 PM. The fall at 7:00 AM was 4.6" and at 3:00 PM was 17.1" and at 11:00 PM, 2.4" making the total of 24.1 inches melted from the snow gauge. The rain gauge was soon snowed full and was practically useless. Total fall of the snow on the level was 24.5 inches. The snow was badly drifted by the heavy gale. The drifts in some places were 12 feet high and the snow in the street was from 10" to 40" inches deep. A heavy north gale set in at 1:45 AM and raged in fury all day reaching 40 miles north at 2:15 PM and continued all the remainder of the day. Its force with the snow was appalling. It blew the snow in fine particles against the face, cutting like a knife." Weve had plenty of true blizzards through the years, but this storm (which I dont even know if it was a blizzard) is the benchmark for epicness. I have newspaper accounts and stuff too from the library. From all accounts it sounds like 25" is a low measurment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Weve had plenty of true blizzards through the years, but this storm (which I dont even know if it was a blizzard) is the benchmark for epicness. I have newspaper accounts and stuff too from the library. From all accounts it sounds like 25" is a low measurment. 12 foot drifts and 40mph winds would most def give the indication that this was a full scale Blizzard. When you say "true" what are you going by? 1974 , 1978 or 2011? Though those storms may have shorty reached Blizzard criteria they are still on the low side as to what the GHD or Jersey Blizzards of this year. 6+ hours of +SN or +TSSN at 35+ mph winds is really (in my book) a "true" Blizzard (that can be debated) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hm8 Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 But since it was in April, I assume it was all gone within a week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 I think Baro will get a kick out of this map.. The surface map from the Blizzard of april 1886 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 On the morning of the 6th, note the massive surface storm system covering pretty much the eastern half of the country. This is also reminscent of the our January 26-28th, 1978 storm in its deepening intensity (though the ’78 storm bottom-out deeper), estimated upper air pattern and extent of coverage. Note the area of heavy snow and blizzard counditions over the Eastern Great Lakes with sky obscured in heavy, driving snow (shaded round circles, not black) as suface troughing extends northward up into Lake Huron as the surface low backs toward the Lakes Region. This heavy snow scene replicates that of our 1974 storm with its "conveyor-belt " analogy of moisture drawn from the Atlantic westward into the Eastern Great Lakes . The heaviest snow fell across extreme Southern Ontario, extreme Southeast Lower Michigan and extreme Northwest Ohio with the ’74 storm also and note how that same area is shaded here in the 1886 storm. An estmated postion of the 500 MB low is included (most likely very close, if not indentical to the1978 and 1974 storm) somewhere in the Upper Ohio Valley (Kentucky northward into the Eastern Great Lakes). Note, the high pressure system has been squeezed northwestward into a "horseshoe" shape pattern, also reflective of the 1974 storm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michsnowfreak Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 12 foot drifts and 40mph winds would most def give the indication that this was a full scale Blizzard. When you say "true" what are you going by? 1974 , 1978 or 2011? Though those storms may have shorty reached Blizzard criteria they are still on the low side as to what the GHD or Jersey Blizzards of this year. 6+ hours of +SN or +TSSN at 35+ mph winds is really (in my book) a "true" Blizzard (that can be debated) hmm..I forgot their were 40 mph winds. In that case, yes that was a true blizzard. When I say true blizzard, I mean very windy snowstorms. Blizzard is about wind and visibility moreso than total snowfall. Im pretty sure 1974 was not a blizzard, though 1978 definitely was and 2011 borderline was. We had a blizzard in early Feb 2003, only 2" of snow but 60 mph winds. We had a supposedly furocious blizzard in Jan 1918, but it was only 5" of snowfall. Some people debate what is a "blizzard" and what is a "snowstorm", and it is certainly true that you can have a 4" blizzard or a 20" snowstorm...but the bottom line is this. No storm can come close to the April 1886 dump. By 19th century standards it would not be a blizzard because it was a heavy wet snow, and blizzard criteria USED to be temps of 20F or lower I believe (that was later changed). The snow was so deep and heavy, they had to saw it rather than shovel it. I have the April 7, 1886 Detroit Free Press from microfilm at the library, so rather than accounts that get fabricated and embellished over the years, Im going by accounts fresh from the day before. Any way you slice it, this was an epic storm by ANYONES standards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpartyOn Posted March 4, 2011 Share Posted March 4, 2011 This is killing me knowing how rare this is for SEMI. I may very well die before I ever see such a perfect set-up! Knowing my luck these days(lol heres a sad story) It will hit the day after i croak! So if that's he case I want a surface map of the Blizzard etched into my tombstone along with , "Here lies Nick...Poor Bastard never got to see it.." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.