Well there's a lot of variables included. This is one of them. I posted some pretty cool PDO stuff a few pages back.. you are right, the later into Summer you go the more important some things are. A side note, but I do really like cold 500mb in any form.. I said this last year. We had almost the same exact strong +AO happening at this time last year, and it was the first time we had a cold 500mb sustained area in long time, I think the whole 2020-2023 period didn't have that. I was saying how it could possibly flip the EPO to negative for the Winter, and we did in fact have some -EPO driven cold. All these composites of best snowfall DCA seasons have cold 500mb all over the N. Hemisphere in the Fall before then.. it doesn't matter so much if there is PNA etc. just that there is widespread 500mb cold. I think it's a new pattern that we entered into last year.