LibertyBell

thats why my main arguments are based on air pollution and health, it is much easier to prove and generally agreed upon. If any disagreed they stopped doing so when the pandemic hit and air quality greatly improved. The climate connection has to be based on many decades of data and while many see it, it is harder to prove.

renewable energy is well on its way to being cheaper and more cost effective. Also, I dont know about you, but I'd rather not live in a country like India where the smog from dirty fuel powered cars is so bad that you need to wear an oxygen mask, and that was well before the pandemic hit. People were suffering from breathing problems and headaches and even burning eyes. It took the pandemic to hit to make air quality better. Also the high asthma rates in urban areas have been clearly linked to higher pollution levels and lower air quality because of vehicles. That's why Amazon and Uber are now switching to electric vehicles and why the MTA has switched to hybrid buses. what you said about renewable energy being much more expensive may have been true maybe 20 years ago but is no longer the case and will be much cheaper than fossil fuels by 2030. which is another reason many large corporations are making the switch. it's a win/win for them and for us.

life expectancy is being shortened because of dirty fossil fuels and air pollution, they are worse for health than tobacco smoking

also being sued by NJ and NY and 19 other states to allocate funds to combat climate change induced sea level rise and forest fires.

Decades from now, should humanity survive, this period will represent a great case study for historians and psychologists on how society can be influenced by a few very powerful people.

particularly when the models have been more conservative vs whats actually happening via sea level rise

and he doesn't address WHY we've had stronger el ninos more recently, the fact is that studies have connected that to AGW also.

I'm angry because these guys give a pass to the fossil fuel cartel, which is the single most corrupt industry on the planet right now. And that's saying a lot because pharma is right behind them.

if anything it's going to be worse than what the climate models show- look at the sea level rise forecasts, verification seems to be on the side of the more extreme climate models.

it's ridiculous. The rise in humidity and dew points only makes things FAR worse, as we've experienced here on the east coast. It traps pollutants closer to the ground and the air quality has been getting worse.

the fact that it's cheaper and more widely used makes it worse, that's a major reason why there is a diabetes pandemic going on in minority communities. More limbs have been lost to diabetes in the past 20 years than to being in the military. https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/why-high-fructose-corn-syrup-is-bad Read up. By the way artificial sweeteners have their own issues. Diet soda consumption isn't a good idea either, it affects the gut biome negatively. You might also be interested in this https://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/24/magazine/the-extraordinary-science-of-junk-food.html https://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/18/books/salt-sugar-fat-by-michael-moss.html https://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/23/health/23well.html Shows why obesity and diabetes type 2 have risen so quickly in the past 20 years. And a concurrent rise in insulin prices.....

I do too, but I believe it will require an entire reworking of society into something much more sustainable (that is work with nature, rather than against it.)

Yep, and people still argue about processed food and high fructose corn syrup, even though the twin pandemics of diabetes and obesity makes it all too clear. The more things change the more they stay the same.

I was actually referring to farm animals methane output which, if combined together adds up to being the third most emitting "country"- behind only China and the US. A forest is more helpful because trees are carbon sinks, that's why planting (many) more trees is a good idea- as is reducing humankind's biological footprint. Not to mention reducing air pollution by reversing urbanization.

I'm surprised people still argue about this. This was settled back in the 90s if I'm not mistaken, maybe even sooner. How long did the argument over the health risks of tobacco go on for, Don?

I'm surprised the NY Times didn't, they're pretty progressive on these topics! I saw an analysis that shows that climate change has caused more pollution over the LA region (more smog), and that was a few years ago, before these fires became so common.

One way or the other nature will take care it. It would behoove us to do it first, nature's method might not be too desirable for humanity heh.

The answer is more than just that. Human land use is also to blame- 1) is too much animal farming 2) human overpopulation creating dense population centers 3) GHG of course. It's all interrelated actually.

I hope you dont believe the fossil fuel cartel are the "good guys" here. They have plenty of skeletons in their closet and deserve to be taken down for it.

It also speaks volumes that the fossil fuel cartel tried to cover up the research. We've evolved beyond prove and need to decide how to punish them. NJ recently joined 19 other states in suing them to get funds that are needed to mitigate against sea level rise. I believe that, like the opioid class action, they will eventually win in court. Nothing would please me more than to bankrupt the fossil fuel cartel, a corrupt industry that makes even the drug cartels look good.

Are you familiar with the statistical analysis that was done that placed the nearly 20 degrees of warming in Siberia over 6 months to be over 99.9% more likely because of AGW? It wasn't just the extreme nature of the warming, it was also the extreme duration. Russia has got to be loving it- when Siberia becomes the world's new bread basket (which will happen within a few decades at most), that means a lot more money for them.

we see signs of it already at JFK.....it became only the second location (besides Norfolk I think) to have an 40 degree avg winter temp and 40 inches of snowfall in the same winter (most of it came in that 30+ inch snowfall in January) in 2015-16.

how do you explain what's been going on in Siberia? UHI there too eh?

when do you think we'll have the majority of summers in NYC reaching 100 degrees?

Hey I'm a Gen Xer (but do identify more with Millenials)......maybe it's my/our Long Island/NY education that has us ahead of the field? You look at what the fossil fuel industry and how it controls the education system and political system in some parts of the country- and it's positively criminal (or should be.) F it, we knew about climate change even back in the 80s, and I remember writing a sci fi story back in the 1980s about saying good bye to Long Island as we boarded the last ship off the island as it went underwater and we were the last people left.