It is maddening...I had a minimelt last night, but its only early Dec....some of the best seasons didn't do jack until after xmas, though that is a dangerous slope in a la nina.....most of the good ones are not late starters. However, I will say that last season is one of the better ENSO analogs, and it pulled off the late start. I think we will need help from the arctic, though because this one is much better coupled than last season, which acted more like a warm ENSO event.