powderfreak

I’m already like “what’s the phone number of this company and will it service NVT too?”

Ha, I think it was mentioned in the ski thread... but not what the ski industry needs heading into the fall. Even in COVID times Killington fulfills it’s reputation as a party spot .

I wonder if any of it in VT is tied to that $200-$300 million construction project in Burlington that stalled before COVID too. Largest commercial construction in the state. It was going to be the largest structure in Vermont but they’ve been in legal battles for a bit. I think the last work done at all was last November? Maybe the other VTers know more on that. True on those sized projects that employ hundreds of construction workers will jack up those percentages.

Yes! Last time we had work done it took the guy 8 months to bill us despite repeated pleas that we wanted to give him our money for work he performed. My folks had the same problem recently with a landscaper, I still don’t think they’ve paid him from June despite wanting to. They show up do the work but there’s no one running the “office” or accounting side of things... just one job to the next and “we’ll bill you soon.” Scheduling is often hit or miss too... forgotten times, etc.

There has to be some other reason, unless someone just put a decimal point in the wrong place. I was trying to figure out if any large companies folded or something, ha. I was also thinking I think I know some folks working those jobs under the table (not sure) but even if it wasn't documented that can't make up for 30% decrease. Those crews just don't have enough time for the work, like you are experiencing up there. Every person we called is like well if it's not an emergency, it'll be months. We've been waiting since June at this point. Hopefully this month he said.

Still there has to be something more to it. I'm waitlisted on a guy who's company is over an hour away. Most of the trade jobs are located/live in much more rural areas that feed into the tourist spots, but I'd still like to see a further breakdown on that judging by how hard it is for anyone between here and Montpelier/Burlington to get any work done.

Yeah that makes no sense to me. I have two friends who have bailed on the service industry, one is going to trade school then an apprenticeship to be an electrician after he saw how much demand there was for that job throughout this whole thing, and another is becoming a welder. They know they'll have to suffer for a few years of low pay but hope for a more stable payoff later. Like getting an electrician or plumber to your house right now is maybe even months if it's not an emergency call. Also the strong real estate market state-wide (from down near Mass border straight to Jay Peak) right now that has people gobbling up places just days within being put on the market, many of those folks are all making upgrades or changes to their new properties and are providing a never ending line of work for construction/electricians/plumbers/etc. -30% just makes no sense in that line at all.

I agreed. Bolded is a huge plus. I honestly am surprised to see manufacturing and construction as the big changes in VT...maybe they haven’t rebounded yet? I’m not kidding when I say a day doesn’t go by on my short drive to the mountain that there’s an ad for manufacturing jobs on the radio and if I wasn’t attached to what I do those jobs sound pretty damn good for someone unemployed. And wait times for any residential or commercial construction is significant right now. Service industry makes sense as essentially they need 50% of the entry level staff to handle 50% of the guests... or even less as many places are trying to do it with only their year round staff. But construction and manufacturing are surprising, not sure what’s going on there.

Yeah weird, there are ads on the radio all day long for manufacturing jobs... especially 2nd and 3rd shifts with extra shift pay, $500 sign on bonus and Monday-Friday with weekends off. Ha, the ads always sound appealing but guess no one is filling them. Construction is also surprising given the boom seen with stimulus payments and commercial additions and all that. We’ve been waiting for 4 months to have $10,000 of work done on our place. The owner gave me the impression that industry has been flat out with work, but guess that doesn’t show employment numbers. Be interesting to see how foreclosures go in a few years. It’s not a rosy picture, but it could just be that the hit is coming next year as Will said.

Yeah that must be it because despair is not something you hear about up here despite those numbers Ginxy commented on. Maybe down the road it'll really hit hard. Some 22-year-old who is a bellhop that's out of work right now is mostly just mountain biking waiting for winter seasonal jobs to ramp back up, lol. But that's life in these towns, it just so much different than normal places. It would be interesting to see an age breakdown of those out of work. And also in the seasonal service sector many are used to skirting the edges anyway but when I think of despair, I think of folks who were making $75k but now find themselves without a job, with a house and family that can't support themselves. Now that's scary. Not the 20-somethings in ski towns who seem to just survive regardless and can exist on $300/week. I remember those days for sure.

It did get better for sure in summer... There are certainly a lack of the lowest level service jobs and that's probably it for sure in the percentages. There's a distinct lack of $12/hr jobs right now that come with full hotels (say having 40 housekeepers instead of 12 right now) and stuff like that... most that are back at work were supervisory or higher levels but also quite a few high school kids working as well, so who knows.

Ha yup, I dishwashed at a local Italian place through high school on like Thur/Fri/Sat nights... that operation had the two owners as cooks, one other line-cook, me as a dishwasher, and like a handful of servers. The owners easily worked 80 hours a week and always seemed to barely be making ends meet every month. And it was like a "fancier" Italian spot in town.

Ha people have been mailing in ballots for decades, I used to do it in college for NY state. But I agree, go to the polls.

Yeah for sure. That entire industry is incredibly tough. No on is getting rich off a restaurant it seems. When I go home to visit my parents in Albany, they are always talking about a new restaurant to try out that is located in the same buildings as the ones that failed before, it's almost comical at times. Like oh that building was an Italian restaurant for 4 years then went under, then someone thought they could make a run of it as a Thai restaurant and then it lasted 2.5 years, and now there's a BBQ style joint in there, etc.

Yeah restaurants are like humans with pre-existing conditions... doesn’t take much to push them over the edge. I’m always surprised at how many restaurants that seem “popular” but yet still struggle mightily and even close in normal times. Some areas it seems the restaurants turn over every 5 years if they are independently owned and not an Applebee’s or Olive Garden type chain.

I love that plan. My first season passes were to Gore/Whiteface with the ORDA pass back in High School... I washed dishes for two years in high school at Alteri's Restaurant, coming home smelling like red sauce and pasta to pay for it. Those years were simple. Gore's a very underrated spot. Whiteface was scary steep at the top as a kid, but Gore's got some pitches too. I broke my wrist as a 10-year-old on the Rumor Headwall, ended up in the trees on the right side. Learned lesson was sometimes you can't stop when you fall, and slide a long way. Ski Patrol crushed it, that's a steep sled ride down to a waiting snowmobile ride down the old Tannery Trail. I was just another kid from the Albany area to eat it hard off the Straightbrook Quad.

That's nuts. Even the trail runners decked out with water-bottle vests have had masks on up here even on the work roads where you have plenty of space. Overkill to me, but they probably think I'm the inconsiderate one if I don't mask up when 10+ feet away in quick passing outdoors. I do think it's a nice "team humanity" gesture if you are on a close tight trail with thick high elevation vegetation allowing for a close pass, even outside. Not necessary in my opinion still, but a nice nod to humanity. Most hikers seem to be extremely respectful at the least.

Everyone here has been wearing masks and I can say the on-trail hiking mask usage is near 100% when passing people (even I think some of the mask usage on trail is a bit much, but at the same time I think it's just a mutual respect people are showing towards each other, which I'm all for). I still wouldn't judge your Killington home area based on social media posts from that site. It's funny that in the last couple weeks I've actually heard the Killington Locals+ forum or whatever mentioned by several people recently as a toxic place where a few folks continue to try to push this "us vs. them" mentality. I bet by far the vast majority of locals down there are fine with masks, are extremely respectful and also don't hate everyone. It just seems like drama whenever that place gets mentioned. All faith in humanity has been lost recently on social media, ha. The bullies and trolls have been formally released into the wild now.

It is very easy to forget the rest of the world up here. If you disconnect and just enjoy living, you can really forget everything. That’s why every time I drive past people getting served food in the Piecasso parking lot, I’m like ok there’s my reminder that stuff is not completely all right. But it’s very easy to live a sheltered life if you chose to up here. The most I hear from the media are in CPicks posts, ha.

I just want this. November 2018, early season snow and reducing the number of stick season days. Followed by a day like this later in the winter. Guess we go for quality over quantity this winter.

Fleece or buff or neck gaiter or whatever is my understanding. I wear one anyway, too. Stowe's electronic signboard calls it a "face covering" not a mask. Something you can pull up over your face. I don't think there's any science to it except it helps to have a policy like that with no gray areas and most people wear them anyway. That way you don't have to try to delineate where a mask is needed and where it's not. To be honest, these are for-profit companies that aren't happy about restricting capacity (costing them money) but they need the season to happen. They know they'll lose money this year but it's about business continuity. The entire local economy also relies on the various ski resorts operating. They also know that if there are COVID outbreaks and things aren't going well, they want to be able to appease local governments by saying "See, we require a mask or face covering and are doing our part to help both the economy and public health."

Literally no one seems to be following that stuff that I can see. There's no penalties it seems either. So I wouldn't waste a ton of energy worrying about it for now. And I still haven't seen anyone genuinely whining about out of staters, except some vocal minority of nut-bags online that want to keep everything for themselves. If you remove the stuff you read online, you'd never even know it. I know you're in a tough spot but it's clunky in a lot of places that I can't imagine people are following. I would think your husband traveling for clinicals is similar to traveling for a job and would be exempt. Is it true that RI residents need to quarantine to visit MA? Who's doing that? It's all just political posturing by the states to try to cover their asses if things go south..."Look, see, we tried to restrict access." Just enjoy the turns this winter and remember it's a privileged life we live to be able to do these leisure recreation activities, at least that's going to be my motto. Like PowderBeard.

Disagree. I think people have COVID fatigue. It takes a lot of energy to stay safe, ha. But yeah, you can see what happens when a lot of people get together indoors...there are universities across the US that are just baking out COVID positives like they are weed cookies in the dorm common kitchen. University of Alabama has had 1,000+ positive cases in the first 10 days of classes.... they found another like 400 in the past day or two. Was it University of North Carolina that was open for 3 days before hundreds tested positive and they went to full online learning? The best bet right now for everything from schools to businesses and ski resorts is to do anything to mitigate that, as you're pretty much forced to shut 'er down in a big outbreak. Wearing a mask and capping skier visits is how the ski areas are going to try to do it. Honestly, a reservation system on busy holiday periods might make for a better experience than the free for all crowds, ha.

Yikes! Our hidden obstacles are old racing timing wire that seems to be strung along a variety of trails and I know we've tried to remove a lot of it (I once walked Liftline and the woods pulling it up) but on the sides of some trails is still that thin black cable hung in trees from like 1950 that when the snowpack gets really deep, all the sudden there's this clothesline wire chest high in the woods. Ski areas have all sorts of junk left over but barbed wire is a whole other ballgame, ha. Good luck against that.

Honestly the only ones I've seen of that are just wishful thinking locals at some mountains who think if they can keep people away it'll be the best winter of their lives. Just like skinners this past spring wanting full access but also not wanting anyone to travel more than 10 minutes to the hill.... skiers are selfish when it comes to powder and honestly, humans are selfish and it's really shown in this whole thing. No ski area is going to ban people based on billing zip code. If anything it'll be lodging right now, where you sign a form that says you followed the quarantine rules. Everyone has been signing those all summer long in Stowe, but we all know they aren't following it because it's impossible to go two weeks without coming into contact with anyone. I bet Killington will have a reservation system like Vail announced. I know Alterra is beta-testing one right now and likely rolls out a similar system. The mountains want to know who is coming and it also helps the communities from becoming overwhelmed with people. Lodging at only 50% also helps capacity. The one thing I keep remembering is to take a deep breath and remember that it's just ONE winter in a global pandemic. Chances of a vaccine and moving past this are very high by winter 2021-22. It's obviously not ideal or normal, but people are eating food at restaurant tables in parking lots right now and kids can't go to school full time. That's where we are. It is what it is this winter. I'm just trying to enjoy every turn I take and if I do a lot less skiing than a normal winter, so be it. There will be other winters, not the end of the world.