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Mountain West Discussion


Chinook
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Loveland should be ok, RH's there this morning have recovered to 90%+, winds should be much lighter, and the fire front is in grasses.  I do think that parts of west Loveland dodged a bullet yesterday.  As for our neighborhood, it has burned thru about 30% of the neighborhood and the VFD along with the IC crews are still battling.  Fortunately since yesterday morning it appears to be active and not extreme.  Reduced wind speed should allow aviation on it today which will help a ton.  My home is furthest from the Miller Fork drainage, so I appear to be in good shape.  I personally dodged a big giant bullet (so far), but others not so lucky.

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37 minutes ago, Chinook said:

The GFS, Euro, and Canadian all show measurable snow in the next 7 days north of Denver.  There's certainly a good chance of over 6" of snow for the north mountains. It is snowing in Iowa right now, so that's pretty early in the season for that area.

We can hope.  I have never wished for winter as hard as I do now, and I love snow so the bar was already set pretty high :)

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This is the furthest south I've ever seen a model show snow in October. It does snow here in October some years, even in La Ninas, but it's still kind of amazing. Really does rival the September storm, as a huge temperature drop in a short time. I guess the September setup was 50 degrees cooler here, but still. Record cold in Albuquerque in October would be highs in the 30s and lows below 20 or so. The weather service has 40s for highs and some 20s lows. We did drop to 22 last October one night.

Image

 

 

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The progression of the pattern recently, with the -NAO collapsing into huge cold dumps in Montana sort of reminds me of late January to February 2019. You had pretty intense cold in the Midwest - briefly - in both the current setup and back then, and then basically record cold for an extended period in Montana. 

The period after Epsilon and the storm this week in CO/NM and the Plains is probably going to be pretty quiet. I'd expect things to get more interesting around Thanksgiving though.

 

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Greetings all.  Just spent a week being evacuated and got back into our house yesterday (Lory State Park area).  The extent of the fires and drought conditions is unreal.  I don’t know what it will take to break down the pattern of nearly constant high pressure ridges in the western US, but that pattern is certainly the main culprit for the extreme conditions.  Once in a great while the pattern will relax and a storm will get through - only to be followed by a ridge re-establishing. Rinse and repeat.

Of course fires are nature’s way of regenerating healthy forests.  This regeneration can only happen IF there is a period of cooler temps/storminess to enable it - and as we’ve seen over the past couple decades this cannot be taken for granted.  With each passing year life in the western US gets more interesting and challenging.

I'm Thankful and in awe of the job the fire fighters are doing in exceptionally bad conditions.  They (and all of us!) desperately need a break from this relentlessly wicked weather pattern :raining:.

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The local NWS had an interesting discussion today on the snow potential with the coming system. I usually blend the Euro, 3-km NAM and GFS to get precip totals here for Oct-May. But not in range yet for the 3-KM NAM. 

Precipitation will start in the northern parts of the state through
the northern mountains Sunday night into Monday morning.
Precipitation then spreads across much of the state during the day
Monday as the jet stream increases and large scale QG lift increases.
The combination of Q-vector divergence and frontogenesis in 700mb-
600mb layers will allow for banded precipitation across central and
northern New Mexico. This analysis was mainly done with the 12Z GFS
but looking at the ECMWF/Canadian/ICON models, there was not much
difference with the GFS. The ECMWF produced quite a bit more snowfall
and the ICON given its resolution produce finer detailed banded
structures to the precip. So given the forcing, we really need to be
careful Monday night for the possibility of impactful winter banded
precip in which snowfall amounts could quickly increase. The lift in
these bands could lead to much higher snowfall rates than what is
forecast. And these bands are mesoscale in nature so nailing down the
exact location and timing will be difficult in the next couple of
days. Just realize there could be areas that get only 1-2 inches
while not far away areas get 9 inches. For now we are more
conservative with snowfall amounts through the end of the day
Wednesday but that will be re-evaluated in the coming days. For now
some of the higher mountain areas could push 12 inches of snow with
anywhere from 2 to 6 inches possible in some of the lower elevations.
Even the Rio Grande Valley could see 2 to 4 inches of snow during
this time. The good thing is that much of the state will see very
beneficial precipitation.
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The models are kind of a mess down here. Last I looked, the GFS had surface temps reaching ~32F in the city at noon, the Euro at 6 pm, and the 3-km NAM at 6 am - this all Monday.

The 3-km NAM is usually pretty good with timing temperature changes here, so hoping the next set of runs are closer. The local NWS already has a winter storm watch out for a lot of New Mexico. I'd expect Albuquerque to go in a Winter Weather Advisory for 1-4" of snow for something like 3 pm Monday to 10 am Tuesday, but we'll see what they do. 

I'm a little hesitant to buy much more than 3 inches of snow here no matter what the models say, since the 1931-2019 record for October snow is 3.2 inches.

 

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Look at tonight's GFS. This is 100% absolutely nuts for lower elevations of New Mexico and West Texas and western Kansas-- up to 25" with ratios near Dalhart, TX. The weird part is, the new hurricane near Louisiana could be feeding moisture into this system by the time it gets down there.

 

JoZGR57.png

 

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What do you make the temperature differences in the models? When I looked last night, the GFS had lows around 18 in Albuquerque, the Euro around 26, and the NAM around 22. Those are huge differences and I find that the "snow shadow" below the canyons here is often overcome when the temperatures are below 25.

I'm a little concerned the models have a terrible reading on temperatures though - the local NWS had a low of 39 for this morning and it only fell to 58 with a south wind and clouds overhead. If the high is 78 instead of 73 because of that, it's just a couple more hours until the cold front kills off the heat.

NM-10-25-to-10-28

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I've got heavy snow rates here.

Edit:

I measured 3.5". It will probably be 4.5" within 1 hour.

KFNL 251856Z 35014KT 1/4SM +SN FZFG OVC004 M11/M13 A3026 RMK AO2 TWR VIS 2 SLP301 P0000 T11111133 FZRANO
KFNL 251838Z 36013KT 1/4SM +SN FZFG BKN004 OVC008 M11/M13 A3025 RMK AO2 TWR VIS 2 P0000 FZRANO
KFNL 251824Z 35012KT 1/4SM +SN FZFG OVC007 M11/M13 A3027 RMK AO2 TWR VIS 2 CIG 005V009 P0000 FZRANO

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Bands giveth and bands taketh away. We got 2" earlier, not much the past 2 hours and now it is partly sunny and 15 F. 

Differences west of the Divide are pretty incredible: we were in Avon Fri night-Sun AM with daytime temps in the mid to upper 50s and only down to the upper 30s at night. Today it was 36 at the Eisenhower Tunnel (11K ft) at about 3 PM, then within two miles down the hill toward Georgetown it dropped 30 degrees. Was 5 in Georgetown.

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