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MO/KS/AR/OK 2019-2020 Winter Wonderland Discussion


JoMo
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Still around, just not believing anything this season until it happens lol....been burnt too many seasons here now! Hope you guys are all doing well, would love to see some early accumulating snow though. So what was everyones low temp this morning, it got down to 17 here!!!!! When I let our cat out at 4am my temp guage said 17, crazy cold for this time of the year.

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3 hours ago, NwWhiteOut said:

What's your personal thinking for down my way JoMo? Tulsa seems to be lost in confusion as normal lol. Who knows, but this would be an awesome start to the season for sure!

It's tough to say down that way due to thermal issues, but it'll probably still snow at some point. 

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4 hours ago, NwWhiteOut said:

What's your personal thinking for down my way JoMo? Tulsa seems to be lost in confusion as normal lol. Who knows, but this would be an awesome start to the season for sure!

Here’s is my 2 cents based on 43 years of history living in this area. Nothing earth-shattering here but thought I’d weigh in since you asked.  First, some facts: 

1.  November snowfall in NWAR is very unusual.   Since 1949, when NWS started keeping records, measureable snow has fallen only 13 times.  

2.  2.0 inches on Monday would put Fay in the top 7 snowiest Nov’s on record.  4 inches would be top 3.  Number one is 8 inches back in 1976 so that record should be safe.  

Historically, our better snowfalls (2+ inches) come in a setup such as this one.  Storm track is solid (for now), airmass isn’t super shallow where fz rain is the primary precip type, although thermal profiles are iffy the further south you go, and QPF is decent (0.2-0.4).  NWS SGF disco does have some concern over fz drizzle which would suck.  It also doesn’t appear like this is cold air chasing precip which is often a problem (cold rain). 

Models do often tend to underestimate the cold air and how quickly it pushes in.  We have continued to see most models uptick in amounts the last 36-48 hours.  

The ‘ol fly in the ointment is that the storm arrives during the daytime hours.  At least we’ll get to see it falling but that may cut down on totals some.  

Finally, where banding sets up is also a key factor.  I would not be surprised to see some area between NE OK, NWAR, SW MO pick up 4 inches.  

I have had a new snow shovel for 2+ years now and I’ve still not gotten to use it.  I finally took the plastic wrap off of it hoping that was the good luck charm we needed.  We shall see!  

WB

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1 hour ago, The Waterboy said:

Here’s is my 2 cents based on 43 years of history living in this area. Nothing earth-shattering here but thought I’d weigh in since you asked.  First, some facts: 

1.  November snowfall in NWAR is very unusual.   Since 1949, when NWS started keeping records, measureable snow has fallen only 13 times.  

2.  2.0 inches on Monday would put Fay in the top 7 snowiest Nov’s on record.  4 inches would be top 3.  Number one is 8 inches back in 1976 so that record should be safe.  

Historically, our better snowfalls (2+ inches) come in a setup such as this one.  Storm track is solid (for now), airmass isn’t super shallow where fz rain is the primary precip type, although thermal profiles are iffy the further south you go, and QPF is decent (0.2-0.4).  NWS SGF disco does have some concern over fz drizzle which would suck.  It also doesn’t appear like this is cold air chasing precip which is often a problem (cold rain). 

Models do often tend to underestimate the cold air and how quickly it pushes in.  We have continued to see most models uptick in amounts the last 36-48 hours.  

The ‘ol fly in the ointment is that the storm arrives during the daytime hours.  At least we’ll get to see it falling but that may cut down on totals some.  

Finally, where banding sets up is also a key factor.  I would not be surprised to see some area between NE OK, NWAR, SW MO pick up 4 inches.  

I have had a new snow shovel for 2+ years now and I’ve still not gotten to use it.  I finally took the plastic wrap off of it hoping that was the good luck charm we needed.  We shall see!  

WB

Nice, waterboy.  Sounds good to me.

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Not really looking for big amounts with the sun angle, and marginal temps. If it comes down hard enough (banding) then it could accumulate a couple of inches. We'll have to wait and see where the bands set up, but it looks like somewhere around N AR to S MO has the best shot. 

The tail end of this system cuts off and later forms into an upper low and tries to wrap more snow around for E AR and E MO on Thursday or so.

The 12z GEM actually wraps the tail end up faster, but this is a bias usually:

gem_mslp_pcpn_frzn_scus_17.png

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The 12z UKMET is also spinning the upper low up quicker like the 12z GEM. 12z Euro starting shortly.......

EDIT: 12z Euro has more of a mix over NW AR. 1-2" snow amounts for QPF in that area. Heaviest QPF (snow) along and N of I-44 in MO with 3-4" amounts.

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33 minutes ago, JoMo said:

The 12z UKMET is also spinning the upper low up quicker like the 12z GEM. 12z Euro starting shortly.......

EDIT: 12z Euro has more of a mix over NW AR. 1-2" snow amounts for QPF in that area. Heaviest QPF (snow) along and N of I-44 in MO with 3-4" amounts.

How's the Euro look for Thursday's low?

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And so it begins. Jeez...

Area Forecast Discussion
National Weather Service Tulsa OK
927 PM CST Sun Nov 11 2018

...UPDATE...

.DISCUSSION...
Precipitation continues to expand from eastern NM through the TX
Panhandle and extending across southern KS. A notable uptick in
precipitation intensity has been observed across the TX Panhandle
with recent reports of thundersnow, and this band of associated
forcing will begin to extend eastward overnight with an expected
increase in precip into NE OK late tonight. Additionally, the
widespread ongoing convection over E TX will gradually lift
northward into SE OK later tonight before spreading more east of
the forecast area early Monday.

Regarding the winter weather potential, the recent operational
HRRR runs have verified well with the sfc freezing line, where as
the recent 00z NAM showed considerable error across western KS
with its 3HR fcst. This trend will be closely followed as the
aforementioned NAM run is more aggressive with the freezing line
south of I-44 during the the period of strongest lift around mid
morning Monday. Also, data trends have been more northward with
the mid level dry intrusion which, if verified, would quickly
limit the snow potential southeast of Interstate 44 during the day
Monday. In typical fashion, Southern Plains winter event are
seldom straight forward. The updated forecast will adjust for
precip coverage trends through the early morning hours otherwise
the overnight forecast remains on track.
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Guess I should go to bed so I can wake up and watch it snow later today. Not really looking for much accumulation, just want to see it come down, rare sight before Thanksgiving.

00z Euro says the upper low still may be in play for eastern MO/AR on Thurs.

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