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Tropical Season 2017


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On 9/11/2017 at 8:43 PM, CT Rain said:

I was saying the Keys aren't as bad as Barbuda - in response to Kevin's post.

Just saw this flyover footage of Big Pine Key. Not as bad as Barbuda but comparisons could definitely be drawn... wow. This is where most of the endangered Key deer live, so I'm guessing their population took a sizable hit.

 

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I am really mystified at the lack of damage on Key West given that the eastern half of the island sat in the eyewall.  It's hard to even find many trees down in those aerial photos. 

I mean, how did Miami record stronger winds?

This is really going to empower the religious folks who believe the gotto at St. Mary's will continue to protect the island for as long as it stands.

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42 minutes ago, eekuasepinniW said:

I am really mystified at the lack of damage on Key West given that the eastern half of the island sat in the eyewall.  It's hard to even find many trees down in those aerial photos. 

I mean, how did Miami record stronger winds?

This is really going to empower the religious folks who believe the gotto at St. Mary's will continue to protect the island for as long as it stands.

I thought the eyewall passed to the east of there....closer to Marathon?

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57 minutes ago, eekuasepinniW said:

The airport was in the orange ring of doom, but evidently the super nasty stuff was along the very inner edge and on the right side.  Still, you'd think they'd take a worse beating than they did.

Capture.PNG

 

I'm not sure if I can shed much light on this but I'll try.  The right front quad does usually have the strongest winds.  Forward speed of the storm added on.  I watched live in Naples as they went through the eyewall.  The strong wind was before the eye approached.  Much lighter wind on the backside.  Even so, looking at this radar it sure looked like Key West would have gotten more damage.

I just read Bryan Norcross's book on Andrew.  Donut eyewall.  The major wind damage was not in the northeast quad but with the west wind as the eye passed.  This also happened on St Thomas and St John with Irma.  They went through the south eyewall and the west wind did so much damage.  Even on the helicopter shots all the trees were down facing the east.

Each cane is different I guess.  

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23 minutes ago, wxeyeNH said:

I'm not sure if I can shed much light on this but I'll try.  The right front quad does usually have the strongest winds.  Forward speed of the storm added on.  I watched live in Naples as they went through the eyewall.  The strong wind was before the eye approached.  Much lighter wind on the backside.  Even so, looking at this radar it sure looked like Key West would have gotten more damage.

I just read Bryan Norcross's book on Andrew.  Donut eyewall.  The major wind damage was not in the northeast quad but with the west wind as the eye passed.  This also happened on St Thomas and St John with Irma.  They went through the south eyewall and the west wind did so much damage.  Even on the helicopter shots all the trees were down facing the east.

Each cane is different I guess.  

But that's because they only had W-NW winds. So naturally the damage would be indicative of that. St johns appeared to have worse damage as they were more in the eyewall itself and not on the fringe side of the eyewall like St Thomas was.

 

There is a lot that goes into the damage side of things. Perhaps winds were maybe 20mph more on that part of Key West compared to the little keys off to the east. That difference could have been everything. You start getting exponential damage as you go up in wind speeds. It's really linear.

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2 hours ago, CoastalWx said:

 

There is a lot that goes into the damage side of things. Perhaps winds were maybe 20mph more on that part of Key West compared to the little keys off to the east. That difference could have been everything. You start getting exponential damage as you go up in wind speeds. It's really linear.

Actually in terms of force applied it's proportional to the cube of the wind speed. So a 20mph difference applies more force moving into objects, much more than most people think.

 

Many people think it varies by the square of the wind speed, but it's actually the cube. This really shows up when considering flood waters' ability to move a car when only a foot or so deep -- get that water moving at higher velocity and it exerts disproportionately more force than you'd think.

 

Here's a great site that explains it: https://www.homepower.com/articles/wind-power/design-installation/ask-experts-wind-speed-cubed

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6 hours ago, eekuasepinniW said:

I am really mystified at the lack of damage on Key West given that the eastern half of the island sat in the eyewall.  It's hard to even find many trees down in those aerial photos. 

I mean, how did Miami record stronger winds?

This is really going to empower the religious folks who believe the gotto at St. Mary's will continue to protect the island for as long as it stands.

EEk, look at this velocity capture, looks like they were just enough west to miss eyewall winds, Miami had a greater pressure gradient, isobars were real tight East of the storm, also a lot of the damage you see east is surge related

Key west.jpg

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2 hours ago, MJOatleast7 said:

Actually in terms of force applied it's proportional to the cube of the wind speed. So a 20mph difference applies more force moving into objects, much more than most people think.

 

Many people think it varies by the square of the wind speed, but it's actually the cube. This really shows up when considering flood waters' ability to move a car when only a foot or so deep -- get that water moving at higher velocity and it exerts disproportionately more force than you'd think.

 

Here's a great site that explains it: https://www.homepower.com/articles/wind-power/design-installation/ask-experts-wind-speed-cubed

I meant not linear, hence exponential. 

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