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West Coast storm attack 2017


janetjanet998

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Has anyone seen any photos, post-100cfm, of the gash in the main spillway?  I think that is the biggest issue now that the level is down below the emergency spillway.  If that erosion continues unabated, there will be no good choice later this week...either slow down the rate and deal with a potential collapse of the emergency spillway, or keep the flow rate and risk a total failure.

I don't understand how they are holding on the position that the dam itself is in no danger.  If the main spillway erosion expands significantly, it appears to me that the entire structure is in danger.

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1 hour ago, ValpoVike said:

Has anyone seen any photos, post-100cfm, of the gash in the main spillway?  I think that is the biggest issue now that the level is down below the emergency spillway.  If that erosion continues unabated, there will be no good choice later this week...either slow down the rate and deal with a potential collapse of the emergency spillway, or keep the flow rate and risk a total failure.

I don't understand how they are holding on the position that the dam itself is in no danger.  If the main spillway erosion expands significantly, it appears to me that the entire structure is in danger.

The pics I have seen so far is that there has been no more erosion back towards the dam from the damaged spillway...perhaps some down below 

but the erosion under the emergency spillway appears to be more the just loose dirt...maybe not solid bedrock but loose rock material and that eroded

they said the flow down the emergency spillway is hitting a large bedrock and hence the spray

 

here is a pic of the emergency spillway which they said was desgined to handle 250,000 cfs.... 36 hours of 8-12,000 cfs did this

C4kPxXtVcAAqJcc.jpg:large

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11 hours ago, janetjanet998 said:

The pics I have seen so far is that there has been no more erosion back towards the dam from the damaged spillway...perhaps some down below 

but the erosion under the emergency spillway appears to be more the just loose dirt...maybe not solid bedrock but loose rock material and that eroded

they said the flow down the emergency spillway is hitting a large bedrock and hence the spray

 

here is a pic of the emergency spillway which they said was desgined to handle 250,000 cfs.... 36 hours of 8-12,000 cfs did this

C4kPxXtVcAAqJcc.jpg:large

Its the first time its ever overtopped........the land downstream of the emergency spillway is not engineered probably since it is the last relief......hence the dramatic erosion....still it seems far enough away from the main dam to actually be working as intended....also people should know that the earthen dam actually has an impervious core of concreate extending from the top of the dam downward at a slight angle toward the lake.......its not like its just earth throughout.......theres also a nother impervious layer lakeward of the main one that acts to provide redundancy in the system.....on the downstream side there are numerous drainage reliefs throughout the earthen structure to keep it dry and stable......the evacuations are probably a good idea but I think the dam holds.......

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7 hours ago, ice1972 said:

Its the first time its ever overtopped........the land downstream of the emergency spillway is not engineered probably since it is the last relief......hence the dramatic erosion....still it seems far enough away from the main dam to actually be working as intended....also people should know that the earthen dam actually has an impervious core of concreate extending from the top of the dam downward at a slight angle toward the lake.......its not like its just earth throughout.......theres also a nother impervious layer lakeward of the main one that acts to provide redundancy in the system.....on the downstream side there are numerous drainage reliefs throughout the earthen structure to keep it dry and stable......the evacuations are probably a good idea but I think the dam holds.......

There's no way to know if that spillway is going to hold if water overtops it again.  Erosion has a way of doing unexpected things.

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ok they have downgraded the equation to a "warning"..um ok

 

I think they should decrease flows out of the main spillway soon....the next storm won't have the runoff as the last one and the ones after that look cold and snowy

I think the main spillway is eroding more on the north side about 1/2 way down from the now waterfall

 

 

 

 

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I'm surprised of the relatively low Inflow amounts all day today at the dam.   Maybe their using extra pumps upstream , that their not telling the public.

It's basically been 30,000 CFS Inflow every hour today...at a time when rainfall the last few days should of normally caused some spikes by now -

https://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/queryF?s=ORO&d=17-Feb-2017+20:59&span=12hours

another interesting bit of info I heard earlier this week.... the biggest portable pumps these days can pump out 20,000 CFS per second. 

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Their saying the main spillway is partially breaking up along the left side.  40,000+ cfs Inflow the last 2 hours straight. 

the bigger problem is downstream along the Sac river...where the rivers will be peaking from yesterday's rains...at the same time heavy rain comes in tomorrow.   double whammy...for places that are already flooded out. 

So it could very well be a bigger story downstream. 

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Yeah, it's a serious situation. But I seriously doubt anyone committed any criminal acts. I'm sure these employees were following engineering guidelines. They have a responsibility to store water as well as release it, and after the drought that has plagued the area I'm sure they were in the mindset of keeping a higher pool of water in the reservoir because of it. But the only issue was because of the spillway failure. If mistakes were made it was probably in the inspection process of the structure, but I don't think any of that would constitute being a criminal. Otherwise it's an act of God and they tried to do the best they could to minimize catastrophic failure. If you want to blame anyone, blame the government for not spending enough money on our infrastructure. Go out and look at the number of high-risk dams (and bridges, etc.) in this country. From the conspiracy theory tone of this thread I'm sure you all will be very concerned. 

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57 minutes ago, Sophisticated Skeptic said:

if you look at the main dam and watershed leading in...the heavy rain is falling directly over the watershed / tributaries .

the dam is located like 20 to 30 miles NE of where the town of Oroville shows up on the map. 

Yes but the main band started south and will work its way north..then head back south again..radar confirms this

 

yesterdays models had it overlapping the Oroville/drainage  area the whole time because it started more north

so totals may be a couple inches less  (still 3-10 though)

expect precip to increase soon  as winds turn more SSW creating  uplift 

 

8 station index now 72.1 223% of normal for the date

 

 

 

 

 

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22 hours ago, Jonbo said:

That's eroding towards the main dam, right? Worst case scenario seems more likely....

it stopped eroding back

they were concerned it would that is why the limited outflows to 65K then 55K as it was going over the ES...then they spiked that up to 100K when they had no choice 

after days at 100K no more erosion up the hill as far as I can tell

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the Low is now projected to be significantly weaker than progged 24 hours ago.

993'ish coming ashore.

now 1003'ish

maybe they dropped some dry ice out there, over the pacific.   seems like quite a dramatic change in strength from a storm that was about 24 hours from landfall.  I haven't seen such model error in 20 years. 

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