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Jan 23/24 Major Coastal Storm Discussion


Zelocita Weather

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why the big dip in precip in NJ vs same latitude in PA? Take Rt 78.... 17 inches on PA border, yet much less in central NJ? Isn't the storm off the coast so why the dip like that?

Is that because the GFS is warm and its snowing less snow amounts but the LE's are the same?

convective blob nonsense. the big takeaway is that this is a much better run for us 

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Uptown cutting back and easing off the severity now...

SO THROWING OUT THE OUTLIERS...EXPECT SNOW TO DEVELOP FROM SW TO

NE SATURDAY...WITH SLEET MIXING IN AT TIMES OVER ROUGHLY THE S 1/2

OF THE CWA. BY SATURDAY NIGHT...SHOULD BE ALL SNOW EVERYWHERE...THEN

PRECIPITATION SHOULD BEGIN TO TAPER OFF...FROM SW TO NE STARTING MID-

LATE SATURDAY EVENING. AT THIS TIME...EXPECT 6-10 INCHES OF SNOW

ACROSS LONG ISLAND/NYC/SOUTHERN PORTIONS OF NE NJ...5-8 INCHES

ACROSS THE REMAINDER OF NE NJ AND SOUTHERN WESTCHESTER COUNTY...AND

2-5 INCHES ELSEWHERE. GIVEN UNCERTAINTY IN ULTIMATE DISTRIBUTION IN

QPF...SNOW AMOUNTS COULD CHANGE QUITE A BIT EITHER UP OR DOWNWARD

(THOUGH MORE LIKELY DOWN THAN UP). AS A RESULT HAVE MADE NO CHANGES

TO WINTER WEATHER HEADLINES. IF TRENDS HOLDS...MOST OF THE WINTER

STORM WATCH AREA IN THE LOWER HUDSON VALLEY WILL END UP EITHER BEING

CONVERTED TO AN ADVISORY OR THE WATCH BEING CANCELLED. WITH THIS

IDEA IN MIND...DID NOT FEEL COMFORTABLE EXTENDING WINTER WEATHER

HEADLINES INTO S CT AT THIS TIME.

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Upton has good PR reasons to be conservative on this. I'd say NYC is looking at equal chances of a thump or bust. This storm is happening on a Saturday morning (Juno was on a weekday). There is no reason for them to hype the snow.  An unexpectedly heavy amount of snow won't be nearly as disruptive on a weekend.

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Upton has good PR reasons to be conservative on this. I'd say NYC is looking at equal chances of a 6" (or less), 12", and 18+" storm. This storm is happening on a Saturday morning (Juno was on a weekday). There is no reason for them to hype the snow.  An unexpectedly heavy amount of snow won't be nearly as disruptive on a weekend.

 

It's been a remarkably well-forecast storm, it just so happens that the 75 mile-wide band where the northern edge of the heavy snow falls happens to be draped over the most densely populated 75 miles in the country.  Bad luck for the forecasters more than anything else.

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Take the nam cut the amounts in half for winter events more times than not and it will pretty much be accurate just an obs of over 20 years on the boards.This is a broad statement but hey it's the weather , may a giant lollipop encompass the entire area from virginia to maine and everyone is in complete bliss.i'll be fishing see ya

 

Mulen!  How's life buddy?  Nice to "see" you.

 

Sorry for the banter post but I felt compelled to put this where the intended recipient might see it :)

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It's been a remarkably well-forecast storm, it just so happens that the 75 mile-wide band where the northern edge of the heavy snow falls happens to be draped over the most densely populated 75 miles in the country.  Bad luck for the forecasters more than anything else.

Yeah, they really are between a rock and a hard place here. Such a small difference in track has HUGE discrepancy in snowfall.
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Question: I know many pros have said the 6Z/18Z model runs are less accurate, because they don't have as much data ingested into them, since the weather balloons usually only go up for the 0Z and 12Z runs.  However, TWC did a report on that yesterday and said they were moving to sending up the ballons 4 times per day through the storm, which presumably would make these off hour runs just as "accurate" as the 0Z/12Z runs.  Anyone care to comment on that?  Is there any other significant difference other than inclusion of balloon data?  Given how critical accurate initial conditions are to deterministic, but chaotic, systems like the weather, this would seem to be an important point to confirm.  Would make me "trust" the recent uptick in snow from the 18Z GFS more, for example.  

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Question: I know many pros have said the 6Z/18Z model runs are less accurate, because they don't have as much data ingested into them, since the weather balloons usually only go up for the 0Z and 12Z runs. However, TWC did a report on that yesterday and said they were moving to sending up the ballons 4 times per day through the storm, which presumably would make these off hour runs just as "accurate" as the 0Z/12Z runs. Anyone care to comment on that? Is there any other significant difference other than inclusion of balloon data? Given how critical accurate initial conditions are to deterministic, but chaotic, systems like the weather, this would seem to be an important point to confirm. Would make me "trust" the recent uptick in snow from the 18Z GFS more, for example.

Storms like this with this potential, normally lead to new data every six hours for every run. What needs to be considered, also, is that, to the best of my knowledge, the off runs also use slightly different algorithms, which can yield different outcomes as well.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk

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Question: I know many pros have said the 6Z/18Z model runs are less accurate, because they don't have as much data ingested into them, since the weather balloons usually only go up for the 0Z and 12Z runs. However, TWC did a report on that yesterday and said they were moving to sending up the ballons 4 times per day through the storm, which presumably would make these off hour runs just as "accurate" as the 0Z/12Z runs. Anyone care to comment on that? Is there any other significant difference other than inclusion of balloon data? Given how critical accurate initial conditions are to deterministic, but chaotic, systems like the weather, this would seem to be an important point to confirm. Would make me "trust" the recent uptick in snow from the 18Z GFS more, for example.

They still aren't as reliable even in that scenario because not every single upper air NWS site is going to release a balloon. The US model off hour runs are a bit better than they used to be. The RGEM is horrible on off hour runs frequently so I'm always cautious with it on those unless inside 24 hours

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