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Big Snow threat, what will it do, part II


Typhoon Tip

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weathafella, on 30 Dec 2013 - 3:39 PM, said:snapback.png

He's got to be less emotionally invested....

 

I'm just thinking more moderation is required here, and cited veracious reasoning...   I have maintained all along, I am more confident of something being on the charts than that 00z Euro run, and seeing the 12z shift around, just adds to my case.  

 

I did offer that a NJ Model low would be a better fit for this pattern.  

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John, if I had a weather related business I'd hire you.

Nice 1/6 thread and hopeful good juju for this one.

 

The problem with that Miami heights and mid level wind teleconnector I have is that it is not a 1::1.  I have seen significant events occur when heights were high down there, and the winds were screaming...  It's just that it "interferes" is the way to look at it, dimming "total" cyclogenesis parameters to various degrees.  

 

If a given S/W approaching 100 W is very powerful, it will overcome that..  

 

I know that some others do not believe that data-sparseness is an issue, but NCEP does not concur with you.  They have recently commented that the dearth in the input grids up over the N. Pac is a factor for the middle range, and as far as I can tell all guidance don't bring those dynamics into the denser soundings until overnight into tomorrow morning.  

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The water vapor imagery suggests that the energy in question is blasting British Columbia, Canada right now.  I think the faster models might be on to something and may actually be correct in a more progressive and out to sea solution.

 

It's still south of the Gulf of Alaska.

 

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/west/nepac/flash-wv.html

 

Actually there is an atmospheric river of moisture extending from Hawaii to the pacific northwest. The diabatic heating associated with that feature may cause some further uncertainty for the model forecasts as that piece of energy rounds the ridge near the west coast.

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It's still south of the Gulf of Alaska.

 

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/west/nepac/flash-wv.html

 

Actually there is an atmospheric river of moisture extending from Hawaii to the pacific northwest. The diabatic heating associated with that feature may cause some further uncertainty for the model forecasts as that piece of energy rounds the ridge near the west coast.

 

 

ooh good pt!   it could cause the models to put the emPHAsis on the wrong syLLAbles so to speak...

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It's still south of the Gulf of Alaska.

 

http://www.ssd.noaa.gov/goes/west/nepac/flash-wv.html

 

Actually there is an atmospheric river of moisture extending from Hawaii to the pacific northwest. The diabatic heating associated with that feature may cause some further uncertainty for the model forecasts as that piece of energy rounds the ridge near the west coast.

 

Oh that is a good possibility.  I could be wrong in reading the water vapor imagery though.

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I've seen more than a few times in a classic miller b they get nothing and NYC sees 6 inches

 

You know ... I remember in FAST we discussed the negative node associated with that phenomena.  Basically, the primary comes along with it's driving mid level features, and then the primary can't go through the mountains/cold dammed, viscous air, so the a new low develops over the shore waters.  But in doing so, the frontogenic mechanics wane with the primary, ...effectively abandoning the precipitation engine.  That fades ... and the new one explodes with the new low closer to the coast.   This is sometimes also referred to as a "humidity jump," and it will indeed cause a stripe to succeed through an event without actually getting the event - much to their bemusement, no doubt. 

 

I have actually seen that happen up this way, too, but yeah -- it's a more common of a boning reserved for DCA-PHL.   Doesn't always happen, but in a pure Miller-B it is something to watch for. 

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I know that some others do not believe that data-sparseness is an issue, but NCEP does not concur with you. They have recently commented that the dearth in the input grids up over the N. Pac is a factor for the middle range, and as far as I can tell all guidance don't bring those dynamics into the denser soundings until overnight into tomorrow morning.

That data issue was clearly stated yesterday. They should be getting info soon tho?
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Disturbance seems to be near 50N and 150W.

 

It's tough to say... the 12z initialization of the operational GFS (fwiw) was more pearled out, showing several v-maxes along a common axis through 50N ... and if you push the chart ahead in time it is difficult to tell which is dominant, or if they phase together or what-else occurs...

 

gfs_npac_000_500_vort_ht.gif

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That data issue was clearly stated yesterday. They should be getting info soon tho?

 

 ... last year a couple of times they flew special P3 sounding missions up in that region to supply better input into the grids -- I think they did so for the February blizzard but I'm not certain of that.   I haven't heard of them doing so for this thing as of yet, or any plan to do so.   But unless that happens, the models would receive the better feed overnight tonight into tomorrow morning.  

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It's tough to say... the 12z initialization of the operational GFS (fwiw) was more pearled out, showing several v-maxes along a common axis through 50N ... and if you push the chart ahead in time it is difficult to tell which is dominant, or if they phase together or what-else occurs...

 

gfs_npac_000_500_vort_ht.gif

 

I think the dominant one is near 50N: 150W seen with the strong spin in water vapor imagery.

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